“Color , grace, gesture. Slipping and sliding through nights humid and intimidating. I am both lost and found in a simultaneous rush of primal feelings and needs.”

These were my words for a Bravo paper promo for their paper and printing. A commercial use of my photography but the whole concept, design and writing was  a collaboration between Polish designer Jurek Wadjowicz and yours truly. Of course the pictures were my personal work from the Caribbean and South America . I cannot publish the whole portfolio here, but it was a labor of love and flat out a whole lot of fun to make. Trust me, the kind of commission you will savor. They are rare. I have never worked with anyone in quite the same way as I did with  Jurek. It really was our baby and he made me feel like it was my baby.

Holding the final paper product in my hands now is a certain kind of experience and way of viewing photographs that cannot be duplicated on the computer screen. Yet I and many others scramble every day to make our work viable for mobile devices, like the iPad and Kindle etc. We see our books being reasonably priced iPad books as a secondary offering for the traditionally printed book, or will it be the other way around?

Either way, times are changing. Some top media executives see bookstores closing and all but boutique printing moving to the iPad. Their feeling is that the consumer will happily pay say $5. for an iPad book rather than $50. for a paper book. I will no doubt end up doing both , therefore spending $55., but perhaps I am not the average consumer of photo books. We will see how discerning consumers move on this.

While I work everyday to create a good web experience for you, I also work everyday in traditional media. I live and breathe books. Traditionally printed books. My workshops which always had as the grand finale a slide show from the week of intense shooting by students, will from now on have as the end game a handsomely printed book.

In April during the Juke Joint Festival in Clarksdale , Mississippi  students from my small class will start their shooting knowing that we will be producing a book titled JUKE.  This will not be an  everybody automatically gets 5 pictures in our class book, but a seriously conceived and edited book where each student is going to have to make a truly strong image to be considered for publication. We  will start building this book from day one.

Eileen Gittens, Founder/Ceo of Blurb, told me her company will sponsor JUKE and give us  very special attention.  This will be the first in a series of student produced books.  These may become a part of our upcoming Burn library of carefully thought out books of all kinds including upcoming publication of a wide variety of photographic artists from this audience both emerging and icons alike. Soon to be presented on Burn will be series of iPad  compatible essays,  starting with Chris Anderson and his Capitolio.


So what do you think? i am reading Ross in our comments section  whose book budget is blown after buying 4 books…..what about this? Ross could have perhaps had 4 iPad books for say $20. instead of the probably $200. he spent…the profit to the photographer and publisher is probably also better in the electronic version…book stores closing down….are we seeing the end of the printed book game?

You guys tell us…..we are listening

3,268 thoughts on “is paper hot, or not?”

  1. didn’t really answer the question there; print vs pad.. i mean its hard isn’t it. simply – i see books as works of art. photographers who are taking control of the full production, authorship and distribution of their books can and will turn a profit if the content is compelling and they are savvy in their marketing. plenty of photographers are already doing this – Stephen Gill springs to mind – but it will be the few as opposed to the many who can really make this work; and of course the main market will be photographers selling to photographers and the odd collector.

    in premiership football here in the UK, money gets sloshed around between the clubs – people complain about the huge transfer fees, but ultimately the money is received by one club, and then generally spent again and given to other clubs. every so often a businessman (usually foreign!) comes in and cleans up.

    is the photographic book industry moving towards this model in microcosm?

  2. I prefer looking at something tangible like an art book or photo magazine, but the “ebook” is much more environmentally friendly. I have a stack of 30 magazines in my office now that I haven’t touched (and probably won’t) that will eventually be thrown away.

  3. “are we seeing the end of the printed book game?”

    i hope not!

    i love digital, started shooting with it in 2002… love the whole thing…

    BUT I LOVE LOVE LOVE BOOKS (paper printed ones that is).

    i don’t think you can replace the experience of sitting with a beautiful book.

    the ipad or whatever you use will always be a uniform electronic experience, books come in all shapes and sizes… textures… the feel and weight of a good book… the paper quality… even the smell from the print…

    my bookshelf is something i cherish…

  4. a civilian-mass audience

    I wasn’t ready for this one…
    I am not prepared…
    I mean really…I don’t read fast…BUT when you see a masterpiece…
    BRAVO to our one and only one MR.DAVID ALAN HARVEY…

    I don’t see “limited”…I see the “only” edition…

    tonight in BURN …we celebrate the Soul of BURN…

  5. a civilian-mass audience

    and I will be back to answer the question…
    I believe …there must be a question…somewhere,near the end…hmmm…:)))

  6. David;

    I have blown my budget for about 6-months; but I also have 4 books that I haven’t had a decent chance to absorb yet; Allards Retrospective, Dorchester Days, Think of England, Story/No Story. It’s going to take a while absorbing all of that.

    I’d rather spend a bit more and buy a book of high quality to hold in my hot hands. But that doesn’t mean I wouldn’t buy an Ipad book (if I had an Ipad!)

    Also; as Imants mentioned (I can’t really comment because I don’t know enough about it), is an essay that is perfect for screen display going to work as a book; and vice versa?

  7. When I opened this up and saw your lead-in pix, it was another one of those “why the hell did I have to grow up Mormon?” moments.

    Damn! Damn! Damn!

    I could have had so much fun during those years when I was walking around wearing a white shirt and tie and carrying the Bible, The Book of Mormon, The Doctrine and Covenants and the Pearl of Great Price.

    But some good things happened that likely would not have happened otherwise, so you win and lose no matter what course you take.

    I think it is probably the same when it comes to electronic publishing vs paper.

    I am so eager to get an iPad so that I can start viewing the potential and how I might capitalize on it, but I have to keep buying harddrives, my equipment has been breaking down across the board, camera and computer, and on and on and on and so I have had to keep putting it off.

    But I will get one, I will figure it out and because my whole career has been based on creating publications that I shot, wrote, designed and produced, I just feel like electronic publishing was created just for me. I often feel like I want to abandon paper forever, but what it really is that I want to abandon is working on the payroll of others. I want to be totally free in what I photograph and publish, and it seems to me that the potential for that is strong electronically than it is with paper.

    These past few months, whenever I can afford to and often when I can’t, I have been putting the framework of a book together. I feel like the odds of me finding a paper publisher for it are not good, although I am certainly going to try, so I intend to figure out how to make iPad books and put it out as such. Plus, I see possibilities in the iPad that I do not see in print. There are certain photo series in this book that could be slowly roll over each other and thus to create an effect and tell a story that would half-a-dozen to a dozen pages to simulate on paper. That, of course that would be too expensive.

    Still, I also want to see it published as a paper book. I want to hold it in my hands, and savor the beautiful printing. I want to be able to lie in bed at night, flip through the pages and smell the ink and shellac on the paper.

    Plus, I think, if you can get a book done on paper, you will always feel that you have accomplished something a little more than if it is just published for iPad.

    iPad opens up many more opportunities, even as it would seem to lessen the intrinsic value, as practically anyone at all can do it.

    So there you have it. You asked what I think and that’s it.

    The idea of you leaving burn saddens me, but you must complete your own work. What you have done here is unprecedented and will live long past you – not as the static work of the dead but the ongoing creations of the newly inspired, discovered and motivated.

  8. Just checked. Three self-published Blurb books sold thus far, this month. About average. Website hits? Around 3k this month. Also about average. So it goes, in today’s world.


    you made me laugh out loud..well, i did not grow up Mormon , but i was in a pretty conservative environment as well….and yes no matter which road you travel there are washouts as much as paved highway…yet either way is an adventure or a lesson…either way has its own reward…

    yes i feel the same as you about print…obviously will not go away for either of us…the markets will shift in favor of electronic publishing, but just as obviously the two can co-exist nicely as we proved with Burn 01…

    always better to walk off the stage before being thrown off..smiling…i am surrounded by lots of talented young people…the whole point of Burn was to use whatever influence i had built in the craft to harness that energy and make it something the next generation could use…they are not and never were without their own abilities, but it is always a life imperative i think to pass on a bit of the spirit if nothing else…just a touchstone of some sort…part of the passing will be Burn and the celebration of new talent , and a flattering part would be imagining that some of it would be at least some of my work

    Bill you certainly have made your mark on the net…and i will do all i can to help you think about one day having that book in your hands….so go shoot a few more from the heart…you always do…and by the time i can get to looking at your body of work , you will have added just what we needed all along….smiling

    cheers, abrazos, david

  10. paper is hot…..and burns easily…..

    spent the afternoon with best friend and his two girls walking around dinosaur bones….can look at pictures of bones forever, but it aint shit compared with the bones themselve as if the weight of breath itself, palmed in the hollow of our chest….

    though i look endless at pictures via pixels, it isn’t anything compared with the book…and today, marinka and i just showed 2 of Susan Rothenberg’s books of painters to those 2 little girls….


    as long as their are books, i’ll buy them…i can read on net/ipad/ebooks, but i can’t look at photobooks via them….

    and when they disappear, i’ll consume photos the same way i consume oj in the morning, without savor but as necessity….and that will be that…

    but, i prefer to be alone with the sound and scent of a pictures instead of numbing into the silence of the data-pricked screen….

    and then there is JUNE……..

    running, wobbled


    Still friend of many distances, feel how
    your breath increases space even now.
    In the timber-frames of shadowy bell towers
    let yourself ring. That which saps your powers

    grows ever stronger from this sustenance.
    Through transformation, cross the borderline.
    What’s your most sorrowful experience?
    If drinking you is bitter, turn to wine.

    Be, in this night of extravagances,
    magics at the crossroads of your senses,
    the sense they oddly all cohere.

    And when the world no longer knows
    you, to the still earth say: I flow.
    To the rushing water speak: I’m here.

    Stiller Freund der vielen Fernen, fühle,
    wie dein Atem noch den Raum vermehrt.
    Im Gebälk der finstern Glockenstühle
    laß dich läuten. Das, was an dir zehrt,

    wird ein Starkes über dieser Nahrung.
    Geh in der Verwandlung aus und ein.
    Was ist deine leidenste Erfahrung?
    Ist dir Trinken bitter, werde Wein.

    Sei in dieser Nacht aus Übermaß
    Zauberkraft am Kreuzweg deiner Sinne,
    ihrer seltsamen Begegnung Sinn.

    Und wenn dich das Irdische vergaß,
    zu der stillen Erde sag: Ich rinne.
    Zu dem raschen Wasser sprich: Ich bin.

    –Rilke, Sonnets to Orpheus, II, 29

  11. I love books. I have hordes of them. I’ve been buying a lot of them in the past year mostly online. Every time something interesting is mentioned on Burn, I end up buying a book, usually online. Just so easy, click, click, it is in your mailbox in a week or two. This week I recieved Sally Mann’s “what remains”, and Irving Penn portraits. I’ve not digested either yet. I’ve also had three 11.5″x14″ books of personal photographs printed within the last month.

    Books are cheap. It is a matter of perspective. Most books cost less than a dinner for two at a mediocre restaurant. I struck me when I recieved Bruce Davidsons wonderfully printed “Outside Inside” that this was essentially his lifes work, and it cost me less than what I charge for a couple of 8×10 prints at my studio.

    I can’t see the book going away.

  12. David,

    Great to see your work published full bleed that way – as you know looking at my books I’m a big fan of that design ethos – the bigger the better…:) Perhaps you will consider such for your retrospective? :):) Please?!! :)

    Books will always be around, many (most?) crave/need that tactile experience though I foresee photo books having a tough road ahead, mostly due to their expense. Only the best will get published. Fortunately for others there is the digital format which lends itself so well to the visual.

    But no way will you ever find me reading Goodnight Moon, Harold and the Purple Crayon, or Treasure Island to my son on an iPad – that would be a travesty. I also prefer a paperback in the hand, even while traveling despite the extra bulk. Some things just feel right….


  13. I suspect for the immediate future the real life bookstores will go the same way as record stores.
    The big box stores will be gone very soon but an independent book seller might be able to stick around selling boutique printed books (just as independent record stores have survived for the time being on vinyl).

  14. David/Gordon;

    Funny; Gordon’s post pretty much said just what I was about to write! :-)

    Last year was a bad one financially for me, so I only bought one book (Sylvia Plachy). My folks go out for lunch every Sunday with my sister; and last year because I was broke I only went a few times. Sure they always offered to shout me; but I’d feel a bit stink if they did that. This year I try to go with them once every 2-3 weeks because I’ve got a little more disposable income.

    However; the meal usually costs around $25; or, half a book! So every two meals out would buy a book. I did spend around $200 on books; but that’s about all I’ll spend on them for about 6-months; the equivalent of approximately $8 per week for books.

    $8 is pretty good value for the amount of time I spend looking at them. Last year it was great to relax and look at Plachy’s book and forget how deep I was in the financial crap.

    I’m also a bit of a boring old fart and don’t drink (well; the occasional social drink) and don’t smoke (about $17 per 25-pack here!) So it’s not as though I smoke a pack a day and then say I can’t afford a book!


    As for bookstores; there’s been a big debate about them here in NZ because of the Borders book store financial strife. Our biggest bookstore chain is owned by them and has gone into voluntary receivership.

    However; the independent bookstores are all reporting that their turnover is increasing yearly for the following reasons; they know their customers (often personally and often recommend books), they don’t “dumb down” their book stocks, and they ensure that they only employ staff who are “book lovers”, they import their own books, try to provide excellent service. In other words; they fill a niche; they’re not attempting to be all things to all people.

    Imants; “Most bookshops close due to bad business not lack of business” Exactly!!!! :-)

  15. No question in my mind, photos in print always win out over computer images. Whether in books, on walls, in magazines or newspapers, a photo only becomes real when I see it on paper. Don’t think that will ever change.

    At the same time I am grateful to have gotten serious about photography during the digital age. Would never have had the opportunity to connect with folks like DAH and all you Burnians, nor would my work have been seen by so many before the web. To be honest, I doubt if I would even have completed projects like Falling Into Place without David’s online and in-person support, critiques, edits and encouragement. The fact that it became a book (Blurb) would never have happened in a pre-web world. So I may love books best, but it was the computer that led to my own work coming into print.

    Regarding David’s decision to move forward after June and give his own work the undivided attention he has given ours over these past 4 years, I totally understand and support him. It’s been an amazing experience to have him at our side during these years, but now is HIS time to shine that laser-like focus on seeing to it that his own work gets out there where it belongs.

    DAH and I are at a stage of life where we must do what needs to be done NOW. Time is no longer the unlimited resource we imagined in our youth. Neither is energy. For myself, I find the older I get, the more focused I must become. Priorities must be carefully weighed and many worthy projects do not make the cut. It’s all about knowing myself and what I have to give. Then doing whatever is necessary to DO it. In my youth I said yes to everything and everyone. In my aging years, I say yes to my Self.

    I hear David saying that kind of elemental YES today. I celebrate this moment with him and say “Thank you for everything, dear friend. May this new chapter be a wondrous one.”


  16. To touch….
    to hold……

    Wendy…………u summed it all up! perfectly
    (funny thing thing is im typing through an iphone which i can also touch & hold)

  17. Differences there is the backlit screen and non backlit nature of books books. Bold in your face stuff works in both media but there seems an extra dimension to the colour as one brushes their hand lightly over the page. One can view several books at once and view in a no linear manner or in a personal ad hock rambling manner.

    With the more subtle images books seem to work better as the tonal nuances seem to lose a bit on a screen sorta like compressed mp3 downloads. My books are different to my net stuff.
    Audiences are different ……. my art kids live with these prototypes (they even like the bag) http://www.etrouko.com/iman.htm but the Information Technology mob are indifferent.

    Time perceived is the biggest difference Ross……….

  18. Ross Borders lost it when they took on Woolworths and the big department stores in a discount war, they lost 40 odd million on that move. Plus they had a weird pricing structure where the upped the prices and lowered in a free-fall manner one day the book was 23 bucks the next 33 bucks and so on it went
    In Australia books are overpriced by the publishers we neverget the cheaper US published versions just the Euro priced stuff plus that fee and this fee and why not another publishers fee on top.

  19. My biggest problem is lack of space (bookshelves)! That’s one reason I offloaded most of my vinyl lps and probably will do the rest soon. And that’s a very real consideration in the world of photo books and one reason that publishers have been shying away from the oversized editions of the past (unless you are Bruce Davidson of course:)). Size and price have to be considered from the get go when planning/designing a book, as un-idealistic as that sounds. It also costs much more $ now to ship the damn things, from printer to warehouse to store.

    I’m always amazed when I go into comic book stores (the serious art kind) and see that they can do gorgeous hardcover books for $25 and under. Why is it so much more expensive to print photography?

  20. “i kinda like that guy that signs under the name ross nolly!:)”

    You’re obviously not a very good judge of character Panos! ;-)

    Patricia; Even being 48 years old clarifies the mind a bit; because you know that if you want to make any sort of mark, you gotta do it soon…

  21. Imants; Here they lowered the price of the Jackie Collins’ etc and upped the price of the “higher brow” books. They had 8 different owners in 15 years, tried to be all things to everyone and employed the cheapest staff. And ironically; made an absolute pig’s ear of their online business.

  22. I agree, Gordon Lafleur. If people want the book they’ll buy the book (usually online for a decent price) – it’s high street books stores that need to worry.

    I don’t know about costs and profits but I’d be surprised if books for iPad outsold printed versions – it’s about value.

  23. Ross – I just turned 47 and I have a two year old. He’ll be graduating from high school when I’m 63! Talk about clearing the mind – or fuddling it up even more! Not sure which it is yet….:) Glad I’ve made at least one mark, though would love to do it again but who knows. Point is now all I really want to make is a good one on those I love….

  24. With a smidgen more technology it will be all print on demand in a decade or so. the positive is that one will be able to get out of print stuff.

  25. Most of you guys probably know better than I, but since DAH asked…. :-)

    Burnians seem to use analogies to music very often, given our interest and parallels to photography: To me, content seems to be consumer-driven and the ability that the artist is willing to relinquish control. The latest Radiohead album “The King of Limbs” is currently available for download in two forms: CD-quality .wav files for $14.99 USD and compressed .mp3 files for $9.95 USD. Of course, pirated versions of both are available…

    Photographers can show their work on the web for free, to the masses, on un-calibrated monitors (such as mine), to stimulate awareness of their work and/or book and print sales. iPad resolution has now been surpassed by an Android tablet (Motorla Xoom) (at least until the iPad 2 is released). I’m sure that neither of these rival print quality, in terms of resolution or color.

    I guess that it all depends on your end-game: a finished book, a “teaser” to support a Kickstarter project, etc. I’m rambling, time for bed…

  26. Larry Towell’s “Mennonites”. Luscious book; lovely rice paper-like pages, gorgeous binding and beautiful black case to slide it into. And that’s before you even get to the images… Anyway; enough from me tonight :-)

  27. Paper is,definitely,hot but I don’t know how viable will be from a business perspective
    in the coming decade.
    For better or worse,I think the e-option will steamroll the print side into submission
    for all but the highest profile,most known photographers.
    David can inform us based on hands on experience but I’ve heard that the majority of
    portfolio/monolith type publications don’t earn a profit.
    As I sit in my living room with a 30 year collection of some 800 books,it’s impossible
    to deny the tactile experience of working through a new book or going back to an old
    favorite as if were comfort food.
    In principal,I thought I’d love the iPad experience for consuming visual before I became an owner
    but with a handful of photo ebooks now on my iPad I’m already bored with the experience-just
    doesn’t measure up,somehow.
    Possibly,the problem lies in the fact the early releases are just trying to be the same when
    I think the iPad experience might be better suited to an enriched multimedia type piece
    That would/could incorporate motion and audio to differentiate from a printed book.

    I think a refined,more evolved, ebook will certainly enable many the ability to make available
    their work that would otherwise be impossible on the print side apart from on demand solutions
    and that’s a good thing.

    From a Burn perspective, I would gladly pay for an extended edit e-version of many essays
    published here and think it is a business opportunity that should considered.

  28. I was going to bed but saw Rossy’s post. It reminded me of some that lament the day of an album’s cover art (and liner) in the age of mp3’s (for worse, in my opinion). Maybe the “finished package” concept has changed for photographers, as well. Going to bed for sure, now…

  29. photography is changing
    world is changing
    consumer is changing
    creators are changing
    old masters will be masters forever
    emerging masters will be mush of bilions clones
    everything will be times million
    everything will be cheap and available
    everything will be better than is now
    will be a million of Harveys
    will be a million of Skoulidas
    Will be a milion of Gurskys
    We will have 0,2 sec per picture
    We will have 8 min per book
    We will have 0.21 of children
    10 ipods
    0.00032 God
    1.30 min for tv show
    2 hrs for commercial
    0,00043 for a friend’s post on Facebook
    0,0000021 to take own photo

  30. For me books always win. It’s about the touch, about standing in front of my bookcase and seeing which one I’ll take out again to have another look at, then leaf through it and feel the paper. Nothing like it and no Ipad will ever give me the same experience.

  31. I don’t think it’s the end printed book, there are more website to publish yourself, print and sell, and I think it will be continued… I love books,I love the feel of paper under your fingers, coverage, print, smell … Henri Cartier-Bresson said : “the picture looks in the books, not the wall.” (Henri Cartier-Bresson affirmait que « la photo se regarde dans les livres, pas au mur » hope my translation is good). Recently, I ordered 5 books and 2 were limited edition, maybe the limited edition is the future for the printed book as an object of art… for me, paper is HOT.

    David, I’ll always be grateful to you and Burn….
    Hope to see you again at Rencontres d’Arles, hugs, audrey

  32. Thank you, David. I appreciate the good word, although I know the mark that I have is a very small one – so far. I also appreciate your desire to help. That helps me a lot, right there.

    Ross Nolly – the other day I was complaining to my wife about how I can’t buy an iPad and she said if I would not go out for breakfast for two months straight and save the money for an iPad, I would have it.

    But I can’t eat oatmeal at home every damn day for two months!

    I just got to have my ham and eggs now and then, and a waitress to come by and fill my cup and laugh and call me “luv” and “honey” and “dear” and grin while I take her picture as she pours the coffee. So its kind of tough.

  33. John Vink!

    i find that hard to pass your comment by…

    you mean you really don’t care about all those prints, the books?
    you’d be happy to only see them in pixel form?

    ok, i get the “As long as the picture is hot in my brain…” for sure, most of my image viewing is done on a computer screen and when an image burns into my head, that’s it… i need those images, more and more…

    but to never care less about books… is that what your saying?

  34. I remember similar conversations at the newspaper back in the early nineties. Would people ever read the news online? Were inked stained dead trees soon to be a thing of the past? My two cents was that I couldn’t speak for anyone else, but that I, personally, would never be comfortable reading news online. Didn’t work out that way though. Got accustomed to the new, now I find the old way slightly annoying.

    Regarding photobooks, never had that problem. I think I always preferred the backlit projection going way back before I ever saw any kind of hi-def computer screen. Or at least a big print. Photos in books are just so necessarily small. And the reproducible colors are many millions fewer on a printed page than they are on today’s computer screens. No, give me the millions of colors on the giant screen and let the software turn the page…

  35. mw…

    newspapers ain’t books…

    now surely you own and cherish some books of photographers work… you’d trade them for an ipad full with the same books? really??

  36. I bought a Kindle last January, but as far as I am concerned it will never replace the paper format. The thing is at the moment I am currently going through a Cormac McCarthy phase and Kindle book prices are really cheap. With two young kids, wife, mortgage and a very uncertain future work-wise injury a 6 Euro Kindle book makes sense compared to 10 dollars plus postage and a impatient wait! Now if I buy the book in a local bookshop first of all its not in English, no problem I speak fluent Spanish but I will not find that book for less than 15 Euros and I am quite sure it will be far closer to 20 Euros! The Kindle is not without drawbacks some books are full of spelling mistakes the typography is really boring and I must admit I miss the tactile side of a good old book but and this the big but at least I can read many books easily and cheaply.
    I tried an IPad the other day, great! But no thanks! I want to see DAH´s next three books on paper and to look at them proudly in my library and be bewitched, spun around and elevated to a higher level and I only feel that way with a good old book . I love comparing photographer´s work, two photographer´s books on a table, like last Saturday with Emerald Isle and Divided Soul… you learn a lot by seeing two separate voices but same place. How to do you do that on an IPad? Buying two hmm… no thanks.
    I love a good photo book there is nothing like it, an excellent one is a work of art an average one is miles better than anything on a screen. I am drooling looking at that leather bag with Imant´s books inside have to buy one of those one day.
    But the world of digital has made my learning curve so much shorter, how would of I ever met DAH and all Burnians without the marvels of digital. So perhaps we should have the best of both worlds…
    But I fear some accountant looking solely at numbers will say NO way!!
    And then June…

  37. “So I at least need a sabbatical…”

    How hard was that to type out? But how good does it feel for having done so?

    Good! Very pleased :)

    (skipping your print vs. on screen book question..)

  38. Sam,

    I do have a few books, but I own much less than I know. I think I must have four or five prints from ‘famous’ photographers somewhere. I never felt comfortable ‘owning’ a physical picture. I prefer the immateriality of a picture, the idea it gives me about reality.

    Of course I am always happy to see books or pictures, be it on paper or with pixels. I wouldn’t be doing what I do if I didn’t. But I don’t feel the need to ‘have’ them.

  39. a civilian-mass audience

    Why we can’t just have it All…???

    I love BOOKS …cause I give them away…
    there is a BURN 01 copy somewhere in Egypt right now…remember the family from Egypt…oh,yeah…
    they are BURNIANS now…:)))
    I love the pixels,the dot world…cause I carry it with me…
    where ever I go…you are with me…your vision, your dreams…
    the only way…to “have you All” !!!

    HOT …like my FROSTFROG…and like my BURNIANS…hot like my chickens…
    I am in the middle ..on this one:)))

  40. a civilian-mass audience

    “…As long as the picture is hot in my brain…”

    yeap…I didn’t sleep last night…the pictures above…are still BURNing in my brain…
    and you know…my brain ain’t getting bigger…:))))))))

  41. John,

    ok… fair enough… i understand your point of view. i have learned to do with so much less in he way of materialism… after living in india for a few years with my wife and daughter we passed back through london and had to deal with a garage/lock up full with all our stuff – we couldn’t believe how much we’d horded – we gave 90% of our stuff away… my parents thought we’d gone mad… BUT the things i could not part with were my books… shipping them to australia must of cost way more than they cost me to buy… but what to do : ) one of life’s pleasures, comfy arm chair, mug of tea or glass of red and great photo book… speaking of which… recently got Georgian Spring, great book… love your straw hat shot ; )

  42. John Vink…
    I love that phrase you just wrote
    I never felt comfortable ‘owning’ a physical picture. I prefer the immateriality of a picture, the idea it gives me about reality.
    Smiling…Somehow I am sure my life would be much simpler if I followed your words.

  43. Sam, don’t know about IPads. Although I’m sure they have some advantages — beautiful screen, software to turn the pages for me — they suffer from the same size problem as books, sometimes even more so.

    But a big screen? Have you seen photographs on a new 27″ Imac? And I’m guessing they’ll look really incredible on a 60″ hi-def television, if not now, sometime in the near future. How many 40×60 paper prints can you buy and hang? I’m still surprised the photography world isn’t targeting the big screen tv crowd, which is a very large crowd.

    No offense. I like books, too. They certainly add more senses to the experience. Guess I like the smell of a good book as much as anything.

  44. Like many photographers who are not established to the point of being able to get a book deal from one of the big photo-publishers, for years I had the dream of a monograph of my work put in the drawer along with some complex (time and money hungry) projects that I thought I might someday hopefully get to do, but definitely not NOW…

    Then, the past couple of years I started searching the web for information about publishing in general and I found a whole universe of people producing all kinds of printed versions of their works (not only photographers) ranging from “traditional” lithographic printing (offset), to actually making their own paper and doing their own binding, to making laser printed booklets that were stapled…

    Along with finding out that there was a big number of people “offering” their work in this form, I also found that there was a whole network of individuals and organizations promoting this off-the-mainstream production of books…

    So, getting a new perspective from my findings I decided instead of waiting until (or better yet IF) I ever get established and arrive to the point to be offered a book contract, that I should bet on my own work (why should I expect anyone else to believe enough in my work to risk time and money on it if I don’t, after all) and MAKE the best book I could RIGHT NOW…

    Now, I can’t possibly know how things will play out… my book might sell out and become a classic just as easily as it might sleep an endless sleep on the heavy duty shelves I’ve installed to house the one thousand copies I printed… only thing I do know, is that right now, I feel absolutely great holding in my hands the fruit of my efforts…

  45. JOHN VINK :)))))))))))))))))))))))

    knew we were soul brothers :)))….i once too wrote here (or road trips) about that very think…(though i do have a lot of books)….i almost never make prints any more…left the gallery 2 years ago now that used to show my work (mistake?) and now care more about the ‘immateriality’ of pics…how the stories live on in the head and body of both me and viewers….like Basho carrying his poems in his head….anything now for me as a print, i try something that subverts….put 100 small pictures in a red chinese marriage box and let people touch/move/scratch the pictures (my last solo exhibition)…or do a projection instead…as i told Herve, the astral joy of watching the pic come and leave in a projection….it’s weird, having been a painter (where the object is everything) to know, where making pics (whether seen or not) seems to be the balance, rather than the rush to show, the madness to print, the compulsion to make a book and sell it….

    for me, the act of living (including snapping pics) meant more…maybe that is why i’ve barely made a ‘profession’ of this thing i do….which takes the pressure off, i don’t have to give you that print of Night Tree ;)))


  46. Now, regarding the digital version of a book vs. the “analog”… I don’t see them as an either-or, kind of deal… if I had the means I would definitely produce an i-whatever version of my book to be readily and cheaply available online…

    But still… and in contrast to John Vink’s sentiment above (and even though—just to be clear—I don’t consider myself a collector by any means) I get a totally different feeling when I hold a fine book in my hands, than when I look at the same pictures of this book on my computer screen…

    In a similar way—and even though I mentally know that this shouldn’t be the case—I get a very different feeling holding in my hands the physical object that is the negative of a picture I captured on film, to when I hold in my hands the memory card containing a picture I captured digitally… my brain tells me that both those objects are just necessary steps in my effort to capture a glimpse of what “my world” looks and feels like and share it with others, but still… it could be some manifestation of OCD, but my senses tell me that the physical object is far more valuable (not necessarily in monetary terms) to its elusive digital counterpart…

  47. mw…

    big screens are great, yes. i have a 24″ imac and photographs look killer on it…
    but even though i can view plenty of great images on my screen it will never replace the ritual that is picking a nice fat volume from the shelf and slowly savoring it’s contents, one page at a time…

    it’s not an anti technological thing, i’m as wrapped up in the future of things as anyone… digital books are a great thing and will only get better, but i don’t think of digital as a replacement for books… when tv came along everyone said radio was dead…

  48. Yes, fortunately we don’t have to choose one way over the other, at least not permanently. For a great photo book experience, I suggest to anyone visiting New York to go to the New York Public Library and peruse your favorites. That’s where I studied Salgado and it was a fantastic sensory experience. Combination of great photography, best book production, and old library trappings. The sights and smells of so much solid wood and paper, the old world decor and the finest library-type silence.

  49. There’s room for both paper and pixels. They are just different formats.
    Pixels are cheaper than paper. If they cost the same would you would be
    asking the question? Yes, I say.

    In a modern perfect world we just order the book of our choice, it is
    printed perfectly and delivered to our front door for the same price
    as long-run off-set. When I want to explore the content of that book
    I’ll check it out on my ipod (miniIpad) Ipad, kindle, xoom, touchpad, mobii, gslate, flyer, lifebook, viewpad, nook, et. al.

    Roger Black is toying around with digital delivery with Treesaver ( http://treesaver.net/ )

    Just some thoughts…

  50. “are we seeing the end of the printed book game?”

    I seriously doubt it. At least not in my time. And it is my genuine hope that such a cold, sterile world will never materialize. Again, I doubt it will. It’s too difficult to imagine that humanity would allow it.

  51. And for those who think digital is more ecologically/environmentally sound that analogue/books… Don’t be too sure of yourself:


    “Manufacturing computers is materials intensive; the total fossil fuels used to make one desktop computer weigh over 240 kilograms, some 10 times the weight of the computer itself. This is very high compared to many other goods: For an automobile or refrigerator, for example, the weight of fossil fuels used for production is roughly equal to their weights. Also, substantial quantities of chemicals (22 kg), and water (1,500 kg) are also used. The environmental impacts associated with using fossil fuels (e.g. climate change), chemicals (e.g. possible health effects on microchip production workers) and water (e.g. scarcity in some areas) are significant and deserve attention.”


    “SUZHOU, China — Last week, when Apple released its annual review of labor conditions at its global suppliers, one startling revelation stood out: 137 workers at a factory here had been seriously injured by a toxic chemical used in making the signature slick glass screens of the iPhone.”

  52. In some way, I suppose photo books are to screen viewing what a concert seen in a concert hall is to listening to a CD. Very different experience. Definitely, some photographic work (Panos’s for example) comes out better in book than clicking “next”. IMO.

  53. switch off electrical power, and compare paper against iPad or any other computer/screen tool.

    Paper is hot and will stay hot. It is just so much more persistant. Electronic is nice, fast food.

    Nowadays we have an impression of how life was 2000+ years ago, because we find artefacts from that time.
    I wonder, how people think about our life 2000 years from now – and what artefacts they will find…

  54. Do’nt know if it was mentioned but I have some photo books long time out of print that probably cost 3 times what I paid for it. I doubt any electronic book will increase it’s value over time. So photo books can be a piece of art by itself.

  55. Jorge,

    Very good point – I have several of those as well. Shame is that work is then inaccessible to anyone except those flush enough to pay top dollar for a collectible. But then again I get lots of “fans” who want a “print” of mine – once I tell them the price 9 times out of ten I don’t hear from them again. So the plus side of digital publishing might be the ability to get more people in front of the work. Of course it’s a slippery slope – those that won’t afford $40 for a beautiful hardcover photo book may not be willing to spend $10 on an ipad volume – or those that would spend the $40 on the hardcover may scoff at the idea and/or price of a digital version. Tricky stuff….


  56. Charles, yes, electronic media at the end is about consuption: something you buy and consume at the moment. Mostly at least. On the other side a real photo book is something you grab and review over your hole life, building a sort of relation with the author. Can you do that with a electronic book? maybe, but not in the long time I’m afraid. The electronic mainstream reduces value for inmediate consuption. Cheaper, ubiquos? yes, but in the consuption logic.


  57. HOT!

    I do remember very well when vinyl went out of style beginning of the 90s. Everybody said that the cd was the one and only future medium for music. Now, here we are 20 years later. Vinyl is totally back to the market. Often in limited amounts – yet totally cool – and HOT!

    I don’t see the printed photo book to disappear. There is a haptic sensation to it, and a smell, not to mention this quiet time sitting in your favourite chair slowly going through the pages. Deceleration. The electronic version will be an addition, not a replacement. (I hope.)

    Hope everybody is well out there!

  58. Herve
    I agree about Panos’ work coming off better in print. In Burn 01 I was struck how some of the essays were dissapointing in print, while others were the opposite.

    Bob, yes. Perhaps, as I suggested not long ago, we really should enable the “shoot without memory card” function on our cameras. We get to view the image we just took, then get on with it and make another one.

    A sabatical means a temporary absence I assume. Will Burn continue in some form or we just have a big bonfire, and drink to a great ride? Good either way. Upwards and onwards.

  59. Those are both powerful photos, DAH. Such richness. Then and now…

    Very hot; paper that is. A photobook is not just a way to view photos, it is an accessible objet d’art, an artifact, a belonging. It is something with which you can create a relationship and something which has the gift of being able to become familiar and cherished. The book as memory: your childhood copy of Winnie the Pooh, the book your first lover gave you, the photobook which opened your eyes and gave you resolve. And as we move in new directions in the world of creative funding, few if any would choose to be thanked for their support with an e book when they could be thanked with something that inherently has an element of the personal – a print, a book, an extension perhaps just two three steps removed from the original creative being and impulse. If one’s impulse is to create a film, or a multimedia piece, I am content to access it in a theater, on an airplane, on an Ipad, at my computer, because I see any of those as primary or apt methods of transmission of the original creative message – nondestructive image processing if you will. But the book *itself* feel integral to its message, and has the power to become part of the home, the psyche and the heart.

  60. I have learned most everything I know about images from a screen, but I savor nothing more than the rare and special moment that is the exploration of a new shelf of photography books. I bought Burn 01 when I could not really afford it because I wanted to see the images from a screen that had inspired me and taught me so much come to life in print. Buying something in paper form is about giving it worth beyond monetary measures and valuing the fact that an image or a set of images can be finite and precious and fragile.

    You cant crease the pages of a digital file, or stain them with the ring of a carelessly placed mug of coffee. An author or artist or friend cannot scrawl in their own hand a personal and unique message inside the cover to be rediscovered many years later. A file cannot yellow with time, nor fray at the edges from repeated handling.

    But if nothing else surely there is this: A file exists within something, a book exists alone.

  61. I am convinced that it’s not the world to change, but it’s rather us changing the world.

    I embrace technology but at the same time I try (with success) to find a good balance in using not too much whatever innovation comes out of the box. I shoot with digital for some clients and for others, as well as for the majority of my personal project, I still shoot film.
    I will indeed buy an iPad but I won’t give up buying narrative and photographic books. I like my shelves filled up with books. I like to be able to read a book without needing a charger. I like to lend books to friends and I like to be able to hold them on my lap. And I like to hold in my hands a book just after I finished reading it. For this reason I buy my book in smaller but more precious bookshops in London.

    Like Erica rightly says, a book is most importantly a form of art in itself and we should all respect that, by not buying so easily into the newest technology, without asking ourselves first, what good really comes to us.

  62. don’t usually comment in here, but it’s sort of strange to read this Davids post today, as just few hours ago i was standing in front of my bookshelf and a thought, that has been bubbling in my mind for quite some time now, came that i should give all my books away for free. there’s a lot of books that i truly love for their content and also for other, more personal reasons, as in a way the books in your shelf also represent how ones interests and tastes have changed and evolved. the images and hopefully also the information have been burned into my consiousness so i can’t really see the reason why i should keep them, they’re beautiful objects with beautiful content, but i feel that i don’t have any use for them anymore. moriyama, graham, ristelhueber, wylie, d’agata, ruff, cafe lehmitz, farewell photography, oslo F, signed or not signed what does it matter as in a way i really feel that i don’t have any use for these objects anymore, i know their content, the images have burned into my consciousness. the only thought which makes me a bit sad is the idea of giving books away that are signed for me and contain some kind of written “message” as it would feel like i would tear pages from a diary. there’s maybe ten books out of the hundreds that i would keep and none of them are photobooks. i also think that the thought of giving all the books away comes from the thought of having no posessions at all (except cameras and my negatives) and still i would never read a book from an ipad, i’ve tried and i hate it as it doesn’t feel the same, it somehow feels too fast and it doesn’t give the same peaceful feeling as having the actual object in your hands. the other thing that is in my opinion extremely interesting is that you really do not need the book, but only memorize and also “feel” its content. at the moment i’m reading a biography of arthur koestler and in it there’s a passage that tells when he was in a prison during the spanish civil war (every night listening the sounds of people being executed and thinking he would be next) he would memorize passages from freud and thomas mann and other writers and drawing euclid’s theorem to the cell wall and it was these thoughts that kept him sane, gave him courage, and even occasionally made him forget he was in prison. sorry, i’m maybe drifting a bit too much from what David asked. so maybe paper neither a fucking ipad is hot but what you learn from their content and what sticks into our minds.
    i have already gave most of my finnish language books to 2nd hand bookstores and now i’m wondering where to give the rest, the photobooks and english language books. does the burn gallery still exist, maybe it contains a library of some sort? 1st i thought that i give these to my friends but i think it would be better that they would be in a place where people could sit down and flip through whatever happens to interest them. i also have to mention that not a single one of my books is in a mint condition (except grahams 1st edition shimmer of possibilities), few even don’t have covers but i dont really care as i can still see the content.

    so. giving away free books, written and photobooks. preferably that burn people can use them in some way.


  63. jukka=-san :))

    last summer, i had my father give away ALL my books that i had kept in a storage room in Florida: 3000+….novels, poetry, art books, photobooks, textbooks, everything…all my books from the time i first starting buying them….all gone…to the marco island library, to the 2 second-hand-used bookstores on the island…to the school…all donated….

    he also threw away everything else (on my request): 25 years of writing (poems and poetry and letters and diaries and novels-begun), old paintings, drawings….boxes of all negatives i didn’t like/want…boxes and boxes and boxes…my life prior to marina and dima, gone in a weekend’s worth of work….

    best thing i ever did…

    sometimes, i miss the books…sometimes i feel like i should have kept the writing…sometimes i feel like i should have kept the negatives….but….i was released once it was all gone…

    like each of us…


    now, the only problem is that i now have 8 years worth of film and books i’ve accumulated since getting married and moving to toronto….

    burn all bridges with tongues of fire, joy races closely below….



  64. jukka

    that feeling of freedom from possessions is so liberating, I understand heart-fully what you are saying, and how beautiful if they can be of benefit elsewhere if you are ready to release them. What about donating them to a prison if the screening rules on content aren’t too strict?

  65. Charles Peterson
    I can survive with the lack of space (bookshelves.. there are also pavement, tables, double raw)! So if you decide to offload the rest of you vinyl lps you can do it at my address :))))).
    Also with comic books I can host and give a shelter to abandoned comic books
    (By the way: there are some that cost more than 25… also if they don’t need four-color process.

    “that we will all quit in June. “.. ahh… half joke… .. which half?

  66. Jukka
    once I couldn’t think about reading something that was not in my library but then I changed and I also start to share books with friends. We exchange advise and feeling. And books. I start going in public library. And I give for free or sell the books I don’t need to keep with me.
    For freedom I don’t care if my library is full or empty. I feel freedom more as a state of mind.
    Only sometimes I need to re-read and not all the times I can find in pixel what I’ve lost in paper (and in memory).
    And also for you.. if you have to give away your photo book I have a friend that teach photography for free in gipsy camp here in Italy. (I’m sure you can find next to you some school like that)

  67. jukka–

    i was just looking for cafe lehmitz in all of the libraries in seattle–no one has it.
    would you like to donate your copy to me and i will donate it to the main library when
    i’m finished looking at it? i will pay for postage, if so.
    here’s my email: iamkatia@gmail.com

    it’s so good to be in that state of letting go.
    less attachments, less suffering.

    jukka, i was just thinking of you yesterday.
    wishing there was an easy way to get to your burn essay.
    and i couldn’t remember your name properly so i couldn’t google your work.
    i’m dealing w some material now that is a bit dark.
    that made me think of you.

    i only have two photo books –“cocaine true, cocaine blue”, a eugene richards classic, and “exposure” by mary ellen mark. i would be willing to part w them, as well,–donate them to the library & put them in circulation so others could see them. what a great idea. thank you.

  68. Bob,Jukka

    It must be spring cleaning time. I was talking to my buddy Jerry yesterday and he had just thrown his old Mamiya RB and three lenses into a dumpster. I told him to fish it back out and put it on Craigslist for a few bucks. Some stubborn film burner out there will be happy to have it.

    I keep getting rid of stuff, but then buying more. I just couldn’t resist a Pentax ME yesterday at the thrift store for $5.99. I don’t know what the hell for. I also stopped by the post office and picked up two more books I ordered on Amazon, both used. Larry Towell “then Palestine” and “Paolo Pelligrin” with Sean Penn on the cover. The Pelligrin book is large, 11×14 full bleed with most of the pictures spread accross two pages. Unfortunately, the gutter comprimises many of them. At least the reproduction quality is not bad. The Towell book is by aperture and has pretty bad reproduction unfortunately.

  69. Those images from the Bravo mag really jump out at you. I can tell a mile away they are either Kodachrome or Velvia. That is one thing I miss about film… chuck in a roll of Velvia and you got those colours straight from the lab. Now I attempt to imitate a type of film and it´s never quite there…

    Gordon… Pentax Me Super was my first camera, extremely underrated machine, like it´s bigger brother the MX.

  70. David,
    I bought your “Divided Soul” some years ago and I have to confess to myself I wouldn’t love the same book as I do if it was on iPad or similar stuff.. Paper books should not “dye”.
    Great pictures over here ;)


  71. GORDON :))))….yup….just last week Marina, Dima and I did some spring cleaning too…including getting rid of some books :)))….that’s a cool story about the RB :)))….i once (and wrote about it here) in a drunken frustration with photography/cameras, walked out of the apartment, late at night (marina and dima were in russia) and left one of my camera’s on the doorsteps of a house….a decent camera….film…..sometimes i look around to see if if ended up around a neighbor’s neck…haven’t spotted it yet ;))…


    just arrived…

    PAPER, stiff, hard and ready for action:


  72. Paul, you can tell that those are Kodachrome or Velvia images by looking at digital files on your screen, which are scans of printed paper, which were made by digital files created from transparencies? ;>)

  73. BTW it´s quite obvious we all are in love with the printed book format from the comments posted round here. What we have probably got to do is help the next generations understand the importance of books. They are the ones at most risk in not appreciating and missing out on such work of arts. Like my youngest son who always asks to see the latest image on the LCD screen on my Nikon Fm3a. It´s not that he does not like film he has not had the chance to really choose…it´s just that everyone round him except his father uses a digital camera.

  74. DAVID,

    Funny… I do have a copy of this BRAVO paper promo…. You gave me a copy while we were in Sicily some years ago now… still have it… It was certainly a nice paper promo :):):)… I should have got it signed…. like the old copy of Cuba Natgeo copy that I also found in an old bookstore….

    BOOKS…. I love them…. have so many books now that these can hardly fit on my shelves…. absolutely love photo books…. there is hardly one week that passes by without me getting a new book or at least thinking about getting one…. if there is a photographer who I like, even just few photos that I love, I HAVE to get the book…. I have at times even bought two copies when there is a book I absolutely love just to keep one copy in great shape…. I think this is the beginning of craziness !!! but anyway, I keep these preciously… Even if I do not look at them all the time I still get great satisfaction to know that there are near by…. No way an IPAD will ever create the same feeling… different…. worth it also I am sure…. but…. the real thing is so much better!!!!!



  75. Preston…
    I am not going to get into film versus pixel debate :) Everything can be imitated in digital if you work at it, I know it´s a scan of a scan but the image just jumps out at me. I am not using an incredible screen either…my laptop is five years old! The look of film, the dynamic range, the colours and compare it to the image on holiday lights…
    BTW great images those of New Orleans.


    you three have provided here now amazing revelations to me…i just cannot imagine life without the physical book….or the print either….interesting what it is about photography that moves each of us in such disparate directions of appreciation….poems of course do not need to be in a book if one can remember them…but photographs? well, to each his own pleasure of course….it is a digression, but i do not see the relationship Bob of profession or lack thereof on appreciation of photographs…i read here all the time that photographers feel free to be themselves more if they are not being paid for their photography…sounds good, but doesn’t really work out that way… as in all art it is generally those who have received remuneration for their efforts who have indeed historically done the very best work….

    cheers, david

  77. I buy and keep cook books ……. I do have two photographic books “Storylines” by Robert Frank and “Memories of a Dog” Diado Moriyama and “Japanese Book Binding” by Kōjirō Ikegami that I revisit ……… everything else is transitory or just hangs about ignored for most of the time ……… all those how to and stuff for teaching, but I have the space so there is no need to throw them out. Novels come and go, borrowed, lent to others given away.

  78. i love books, not big on the ipad. and like a surprising number of people here, i tend to accumulate books and then get rid of them (give away, sell to second hand bookstores), but i think that is mostly because i move around alot…or at least have for the past ten years or so.

  79. I quite liked the little Kindle for reading, tried one out …………. the problem is that stuff like Eco, Bourdain, Shuyun, Kremer etc just are not available so I buy the book.

  80. Imants: probably not even close to the same thing as having cookbooks (all mine are in storage). But I print recipes I find off the net. Course, now I have a rumpled mass of papers in my kitchen :)

  81. One thing about our cook books here in oz they put most of the rest of the world to shame, we have a publisher here called Murdoch press and their cook books are photographic and layout joys to own.

  82. DAVID :)

    AMIGO, here’s what I meant….i do, for most of my life, couldn’t imagine living without books…like i said until last summer, I’d bought/received/stolen/collected more than 3,000….in fact, Marina use to get very angry with me that I was sending $70/month just to pay for a storage room in florida to house my books, paintings, writing, etc….that’s a pretty picture of $$ for a not-wealthy family of working artists over 6 years ;)))…i eventually freed myself and got rid of everything….books were donated…writing was thrown out, paintings, thrown out, etc…..free…heart-broken for a while, but eventually free…

    i see buy books: novels, poetry, philosophy, history, art books, photography books…in fact, it makes marinka a bit crazy (although she’s a book hound too ;)) )….and at some point, i’ll have to do something with these things…

    books, as i said before, have literally saved my life a few times….20 years ago, i spent 10 days, homeless, on the streets of Praha, as I thought i was losing my mind and my life, all i had with me was a backpack with my passport, 20 dollars US and 3 books (Rilke Poems, Joyce Ulysses, KingJames Bible, no shit)…..and then in LA, when hospitalized after a 2nd suicide attempt, it was a silly book i picked up in the ward that cleared my mind, brought tears of strength, kept me alive, etc…..books saved me during my mom’s hospitalization as a kid, when my dad almost died, when my parents were divorced and on and on and on and on….

    and, of course, i MAKE books…i have made 3 artist photo hand books (1 a gift for marina)…i expect to finish my ridiculously long photobook before dima finishes highschool (my promise to him), i have already 2 photobook dummies (‘facebook’, on faces, ‘and our memories brief’ and working on russian book, etc)…and of course, the prose thing….

    all that said, no one sucks in the body and breath of books as I….


    what i find dispiriting, often, is that we equate the book as an auto de fe….i mean, as if a photographer must/can only be interesting, with a book….I am not suggesting that is what you are saying (shit, i want to do a BURN book in partnership with someone, as i said ;))), but i feel that books and the act of taking pictures are 2 different things…

    i WANT to make a photobook, because I have ALREADY MADE 3 of them, but i don’t feel the NEED to make them anymore…i don’t HAVE TO make them, I don’t have to see them anymore…..they live inside me in huge ways….cut open my skull, and you’d see like 1,000,000,000 images stuck in there from all the photobooks that are a part of my body…..they are there…..and i carry them…

    it is just that increasingly, it is the ACT of making…and even THINKING about pictures, and seeing, that means more to me, in my practice….i have so much work and rarely have the interest to show it…maybe that’s selfish…maybe that is being tired of the act as ‘profession’ who knows amigo…

    but believe me, in no way am I suggesting that we shouldn’t be renumerated….

    can a poem be a photograph?….

    i will make a photobook with only words too someday….just as my ‘landscape’ essay for you/burn includes some ‘photographs’ that are ONLY words….

    i think history (if one cares about that, though i honestly do not) only judges based on itself….who knows how any of our work will be perceived…..and i don’t care too much…

    i just want a simple thing:

    to have a good life, to love/live well, to be able to write and to make pictures and to sustain my wife, son and friends :)))…

    that’s it…


    history can pick her elongated fingers over the boxes of my books, and negatives and pictures for all she’s worth :)))


    p.s. send you an email on photog…..2nd photographer will send this weekend

  83. Bob I love making books. I completed one the other day………… looked at it again…………. thought about it …….. placed the dummy prints into recycling…deleted the book from all HDs ………… it was a compromise book but a lesson well learnt again…again;;; again…
    Page one “a bit of bullshit”. Page two http://www.etrouko.com/imants.htm
    another book”artwork” journey begins …….

  84. Bob..

    Saw this short video yesterday (will see the exhibit next week), Paolo Pellegrin talking about his ‘Dies Irae’.. photography as documentation, as proof and preservation of history. We all know about the Holocaust, we have visual documentation of it, the famine in Darfur (just as exmples Pellegrin mentions), we know it happened because we can see it.. photographs are important parts.

    Of course this is different when we talk about the kind of work he and his colleagues do, and the kind of work other photographers do, not all is essential to history, but still, it is small scale history in itself.

    Had to think about that after I read about your destroyed negatives..

    Video is here, but in Italian language, can’t fina an English version:

  85. Today, after a two-month wait, I received a book in the mail: Nicosia in Dark and White, by burn’s own Thodoris Tzalavars. It kind of brought this discussion home to me.

    I have enjoyed Thodori’s images online. I have a 27 inch Apple cinema monitor that I bought a couple of years back so that I could view double truck layouts full size on screen and I love the way pictures look on it. I loved looking at Thodoris’s Nicosia pictures on it.

    But today, after I received his book, I left my computer, sat on the couch, turned on the lamp, opened it up, read David Alan Harvey’s amazing introduction, than just sat there, slowly turning through the pages, taking in the scent of the paper and the ink, seeing that paper look, studying the images.

    The images were smaller than on my screen, but the experience richer.

    When I finally get an iPad, I will sit on the couch and view Thodoris’s pictures on it to see how the experience compares – but I already know that the paper book experience will win.

    I think I will go to bed early tonight, take Thodoris’s book with me, and slowly look at it until I grow so drowsy I begin to fall asleep.

  86. BOB..

    i understand you perfectly…i know how you are about your work and how much you care….each of us can have a deep love of pictures, of books, and of whatever part of the process moves us the most…i only find it INTERESTING AS HELL how others see it…not chastising at all…for example Michael Webster prefers the screen…better color…he is right, pictures do have a more luminescent look on the iPad than they do in a paper book…so that is his reason for preferring screen over paper…cool…Imants only has three photo books (hard to imagine), yet builds his own handmade ones every day…cool…you do not NEED to make a book right now…also cool….

    the question i asked here on this post and the answers i am tallying is NOT to pass value judgment AT ALL…i am simply curious where the trend will be for the future….for practical reasons….our aesthetic reasons are our own but we either buy the iPad or we go to the bookstore and buy books , or maybe some do both of course…i am not sure if this audience is a good sampling of the population in general…this audience probably loves paper books more than if i were to query people off the street…but who knows, we could all be surprised…

    new media always shakes up the old but rarely replaces it….photography itself shook the realists and likes of Braque and Picasso and Cubism were born..TV might have appeared that it would replace radio in the early 50″s but alas serialized shows disappeared (ought to bring em back!) but NPR was born…vinyl rocks…etc etc…Burn itself is online and in print….ahhh, hmmm,well, i gotta love 01 more than online…smiling..sits on my coffee table by the fire…comforting…:)

    cheers, david

  87. Would those of you who shot slide film…example Velvia before digital became majority that perhaps we don’t need that fiddly raw file. Maybe if camera makers pull their socks up and start concentrating on building sensors/cameras which can produce a decent tiff file or a similar file where there would be no need to fiddle with white balance, exposure, contrast and etc…in other words a decent image without having to waste time on the computer would mean more time making photos. I took up photography because i liked making images and enjoyed picking up perfectly good images on a roll of film from the local lab. Nowadays there isn’t a single digital file which doesn’t need tinkering with! I don’t need a camera that can produce 20 different files that sort of remind me what Velvia was as a jpeg. I want a camera that produces ONE decent type of file…example a GF4 which produces files exactly like Velvia, copy the images off the memory card and send the files directly to someone by E-mail without even thinking of photoshop.

  88. PAUL

    this is the classic example of technology actually creating way way more work and expense than the previous medium to get the same result…yes, you simply correctly exposed a piece of film …and you were DONE…a perfect transparency….still nothing compares to a perfect transparency and unless you are going to spend about 250k for a super digi projector… still nothing up on the digital screen looks as good as a $100. Carousel would project…….or, at least i have not seen it yet…i know for sure that if i sat an audience down and projected transparencies through say a Leitz projector up on the screen people would be shocked..pleasantly shocked for sure..

  89. David…
    Exactly! And if I want to tinker with film and all that, I can chuck a roll of Tri-X, and head off into the darkroom.

  90. PAUL

    on the other hand, i can carry my whole life’s work on an iPad around in my Domke bag, full of enough gear for a day of shooting, and with the same machine write a letter to my mother, listen to Chopin, and read Huckleberry Finn…pretty amazing…

  91. The problem is everyone is forced to be a good photoshop technician. There used to be plenty of increadibly talented photographer who just took photos…and had no interest in darkroom or scanning. If you could not afford to pay someone to print, you could always just shoot slides. So, so easy.

  92. David…
    Laughing!!Yes of course sitting in the park texting with my photography hero, amazing! Can you imagine texting as a kid with HCB or RF with that Leica IIIf beside you?

  93. Bill..

    Thodoris’ book definitely is a very good example why a book is THE thing.. or better, why printed matter is IT.. very much looking forward to get in print one of the photographs.. very curious to see it comparing it to the one in the book :)

  94. For the majority of photographers the question is academic in terms of ever being able to get a book published by a mainstream publisher. If you cannot almost guarantee a return on their investment you won’t get their backing. Publishing is a business and has to make a profit.
    Many photographers are trying the self publishing route which is now (at last) a real technical possibility, but they still run into the problem of making money and of getting all-important publicity for their book. For this majority the IPad seems perfect for producing online books that can be both a saleable item in themselves and perhaps serve as a dummy book to show to paper publishers, magazine editors et.

    So I vote for both complimenting the other.


  95. Imants, I too have “Memories of a Dog” by Diado Moriyama. Other favourites are “Japanese Photobooks of the 1960s and 70s” and “Things As They Are” – both great books but also very useful for studying magazine and book layouts as they show photos of actual magazine and book pages.

    New Ipad to be released soon.


  96. MIKE R

    you are quite correct, getting a mainstream book publisher is still where you want to be if at all possible…at least today..not sure about tomorrow…however, making money even with a major publisher is not the end game for most photographers….at least not directly…few if any make money with books, including the publisher…

    cost of production makes photo book publishing a biz for those who love books more than biz…

    i do not know of any who really expect a significant return on their investment EXCEPT they might just see it as keeping the level of their brand high and doing the right thing for photography while also promoting titles that do sell..Phaidon makes money on architecture books..Aperture for example has always needed funding from donors to publish a book…..there is no “return on investment” for many or even most photo books….most reasons for publishing or not publishing really do depend on the value perceived for the work…yes, of course, some books do sell and give the publisher a return….but look closely at some of the very best…to be sure this is not a proclamation on my part..but it does come from many conversations with many photographers and publishers..

    HOWEVER, having a book taken seriously will have you taken seriously all around and should still be the highest goal for photographers whose intention is to make a mark…..i do not know of any other way (at least traditionally) that puts a photographer in the arena of respect more than having a printed book…usually these are mainstream publishers, Aperture , Phaidon, Steidl, Powerhouse, etc etc…some self published books have also done well…see PDN magazine this month….and yes the iPad could change the equation entirely from a business perspective and i am fascinated…at the same time this fascination with the iPad and all that is happening also drives me more and more towards the hand made limited edition one of a kind effort…not in revolt…just for the purity and the art of it….

    cheers, david

  97. Apple and others are promoting the clear crisp look……. everything is sharp and clear ………………. I wonder if that is where the photographic image is bound to go?

  98. Eva they really are not published as yet, too busy putting the stuff together I am at the final stage of getting the files in order, colours right etc. The dummy book prints were pretty important especially the transition from screen to paper. Things like out of gamut colours, tonal misfits all became evident, all boring stuff but has to be done. Plus there is a chance to reassess final sequences, chuck a few out chuck a few images in.
    Learnt stuff like glossy screens are better to get the blacks right, the printed image shows any errors in the whites. The best image proportions for me ended up a 1:1.48 and then there is the usual stuff like transitions from one scale to the next from image to image …….
    The other stuff is one offs……..

  99. Imants.. yes, I know they’re not published.. yet.. but am confident they will be. I love the look of them, how they fold up.. having dummies to play with is important, for checking the colours etc. for sure, the flow, but also to see if the chosen format fits.. very nice indeed!

  100. David, very interesting reply. From what you write, photo books really are a labour of love for all concerned.
    The photo book produced by a mainstream publisher would seem to indicate that a photographer has “arrived” and will gain the attention of the industry and hopefully garner future work. Just the existence of the book seems to be reward enough for many photographers.

    Your desire for hand made limited edition books is understandable. Would you see this as a business venture as in a Fine Art production as with Imant’s work or simply a labour of love? For the emerging photographers here, how would you use the technology available now if you were just starting out?

    Your twitter feed ” feel like I am managing a really young man’s career.My own.Odd and yet amazing feeling.I would wish for all I mentor to feel this someday.” is gratifying to read and does you credit.


  101. “Nowadays there isn’t a single digital file which doesn’t need tinkering with! ”

    Paul… I disagree. if you want, you can load a custom made curve into most cameras these days and shoot an entire project with that curve. Let’s say a nice strong contrast, highly vivid color curve. Now you know that you’re going out and must shoot with all that in mind. So it’s still possible to shoot as if shooting slide film. You just need to find or create the curve that floats your boat. And then shoot accordingly.

    I do this often.

  102. MIKE R

    actually everything i do is a labor of love , including Burn…i do need to earn a living, but somehow i do survive, but friends and family are not sure quite how…they scratch their heads….well it all comes from my work or some teaching and the two are interconnected of course …from a Burn publishing standpoint something like Imants work would most likely fall into the category of limited edition but not hand made…he has the hand made version which is another object altogether…my limited edition and hand made ventures now just involve my own projects, like my hand made family albums upcoming ..again , i would not characterize it as a business venture exactly but high value will be placed on anything that takes me weeks to make..by that time , you do not want to sell it at any price!!

    emerging photographers today with all the new tech need to do what has always worked for artists for centuries…get seriously educated in the world you want to enter….do heartfelt real work… make sure it is seen by the few purveyors you really value most…going for the so called masses straight off will confuse everyone and take compliments from your friends/family for what they are…be ruthless in self critique….make sure your work is seen in the proper context and totally refined by the folks who make decisions on shows on books on commissions in the arena you have chosen…start with an audience of one special person…this will lead to two …etc etc


    thank you for this list…do all of them distribute as well?

  103. Also, Paul… and this is fairly important. Many programs (LR3, photoshop, etc) strip all camera curves when rendering RAW files. In the case of Nikon cameras, Nikon Capture and ViewNX keep the “look” you set in camera. (and you can change it later if you like) If Canon has a similar Canon based program to work with then you’re probably in good shape. Again, not familiar enough with Canon’s equipment so your mileage may vary. ;^}

  104. Just to clarify a bit, in addition to color, I really like the size advantage of on screen viewing. I can currently view images much larger than any book and with the larger screen could see work the size of large gallery prints.

    And Michael K is right that you can effectively s
    Design your own film. I’d add you can create your own developer as well. I’m to the point where on most images I just use Photoshop to resize and save as.

  105. DAVID :)

    ironically, i was just re-looking at BURN01 too….and it sits along side MERCY and MANN’S newest….and for me, BURN01 is a realization (as i wrote when i received the copy) that the on-line BURN just cannot approach….it isn’t that the work LOOKS better in BURN01 than on BURN on line, it is the (dare i suggest) sacred and profane beautiful nature of the BOOK itself…like the fold of hands upon the chest, there is no duplicating that aspect….it is why i always prefer books to online, always…but book also live inside me in a way that pictures on the screen don’t….because, while i can mobilize myself with the web (carry a iphone/ipad/blackberry/laptop, etc with me), it still isn’t yet the same physical and sensory experience…

    how to express the sound of the movement of pages as part of the experience of a book?….

    and, ummm….i guess, i’ll just have to surprise you….

    i think it was one of the first things that bound me to IMANTS, that we were both book-makers….and i have always always loved his accordians of time…tried to get the gallery that used to represent me and marina to have an exhibition of his books….marina, btw, has made gorgeous gorgeous handmade books too….u should see them too someday….

    on somedays, i just want to present to you/burn the final BOOK of what ive been working on for 10 years, or the facebook….and work with you to try to get it published…on other days, i just want to do it alone….who knows….

    one of the greatest of all contemporary american (world) novelists, stephen wright, languors in anonymity….he has written THE greatest novel on vietnam, one of THE greatest novels about the Civil War, for me THE greatest Road Trip novel of American (superior to on the road) and who knows him?….that is the funny part…..i agree that, as a writer and as a photographer, THE BOOK is part of my own artistic apotheosis…..but, how to explain too, that i am just as interested in using pics as expressions of gesture and memory…and that means, at times, turning your back to the thin that seems to be the way to gain ‘recognition’…..

    look through the submission archives for singles ;)))>..u’ll find the final image from the essay i’ve made for y’all…

    lastly: you were in a dream last night…here is the short version: we were talking about books/photography….i made some weird speech to a group of people why you’re photography legacy is inextricably bound to your teaching and the world you’ve provided other photographers (young and old, friends and students, colleagues and strangers), and then you and i were sitting in a rickshaw, driving through the old streets of taipei (or mabye bkk) and you asked me to come with you on a photoshoot in europe and africa (you were going with your ‘gilfriend’ whose name in the dream was tanya) and i was wondering if i could/should go….cause i’d be away from marina, and i wanted to finish my book, and then you said, ‘ok, go shoot your own trees in europe’ ;))>….you were laughing…we ended up in chinatown in nyc, still in the rickshaw, but then a swarm of people calling out…and i walked toward a red temple and lit some lotus….and woke up, wondering if i should tell marinka i’m off to europe and africa with harvey ;)))>..

    maybe it’s your son’s suffering pics that are giving me wanderlust…


    IMANts :)))))…indeed indeed…those beautiful accordians

  106. Michael and MW…
    I remember when I bought the dsII ACR didn’t have profiles yet so I was forced to use Canon raw converter and the images weralways more pleasing. Problem the canon converter was so slow!

  107. oh, and 1 last thought…which is (maybe) a bit different than what often is thought of here (elsewhere) with respect to ‘essays’ vis-a-vis books…

    as David and I have talked about before, i often think in terms of anti-essays (an ante thing ;))…in other words, one that does not necessarily have to lead to either the realization of a larger narrative (book/story) or even contain the idea of a narrative itself based on the sequence of images….where is the ‘essay’ in Boltanski, or in a sequence of performances by Zhang Huan (though there is both idea and story for sure)…..

    i have always seen everything i’ve published (from faces to memory to water to carving to bones to oxen) or exhibited as akin to ‘short stories’…or maybe even poems….but not at all the bigger thing i’ve been at work on, the ‘book'(s)…while they do contain pics from faces and memory and bones and oxen for sure, but they are not expansions or duplications, ….sometimes i have to write a setence or story or poem, in order to understand what it is i want to suggest or create in a longer format….

    this is something, david, i’d always wished we had enough private time to discuss, over single malt or herb…what i want to chat about on the front porch of obx….

    for example….

    here is the opening image of the ‘book’….a photograph i’ve never included in any ‘essay’ i’ve ever published…and have never exhibited it, though the print is one of my favorite, ever….

    in many ways, making these ‘short’ (for me) essays and publishing or exhibiting them are ways to help my thinking for the real ‘book’….

    here is a shitty scan of the print…


    running to read


  108. working on paper books even self-made, onecopy book ect, is one of the best things why so good is to be a photographer. Sometimes it is like collection of poems, sometimes like diary, or novel or encyclopedia or whatever.
    You don’t have to be James Nachtwey or Salgado to made a book.
    And maybe there is an answer what is better Ipad or book. Because who want next file in next computer and who want a own book on shelf?


  109. David…

    “do all of them distribute as well?”

    They all sell through their websites, and some of them use third party distributors…

    The problem with big distributors is that they only work with publishers with at least a dozen titles out and a list of titles-to-be-released…

    The most promising options for distribution I have found are:

    THE biggest of them all…

    they specialize in art libraries across the US

    similar to the above, but in Europe


  110. “Memories of a Dog” Thanks a bunch Imants; another book I’m going to have to consider buying. Are you in cahoots with the bank in trying to keep me poor? ;-)


    Paul, Michael

    Go to “picture styles” in the Canon menu. There are several standard pre-sets, as well as custom presets where you can individually control sharpness, contrast, saturation, and color tone. These of course will only affect the JPG.
    Then of course in ACR there is the camera calibration tab, the little camera third from left. Depending which camera you are using, the drop down menu will offer you a variety of looks. For my Canon files it offers adobe standard, camera standard, camera faithful, camera landscape, camera neutral, and camera portrait. There is a considerable difference in rendition between these.
    Next there are the sliders below for shadow tint, and red green and blue hue and saturation. Neutralize your greys and correct for density before you mess with any of this. This is a difficult area to use, but can save your bacon in difficult lighting conditions, like open shade on a cloudless day. You can create pre-sets and save them or make them your default.

    If you are a real keener, you can create profiles for specific cameras and lighting conditions. http://www.rags-int-inc.com/PhotoTechStuff/ColorCalibration/
    I’ve done this in the past and it worked extremely well, but have not tried it lately.\

    Finally, there are a bunch of ‘film look’ plug-ins for photoshop that emulate film.

  112. Paul, I love RAW but your point about being done once you shot that perfectly exposed slide is very well taken.

    For me, it was never quite that simple, however.

    Before digital, I preferred to shoot black and white and would only shoot color when I had to – like when I shot my one spread in National Geographic. And black and white was a tremendous amount of work. I discovered that while most labs would do a good job with color film, you could not trust them with black and white and so I had to develop all the film myself, print contact sheets, spend hours upon hours peering at those sheets through a loupe.

    Then, once I started to print, there was always burning and dodging to be done. Always. Once you had a print – you had a print. One. Well before it became practical to shoot digital, I bought a Leafscan film scanner and began to scan all my tri-x and T-Max. That, too, was a time consuming process, because you still had to do all the burning and doding – but inside the computer. Once you were done, however – you had the image and you could reuse it as many times as you want.

    When I made the jump to my first digital camera, the Canon D6 – or 6D? – in 2002, my intent was to continue on as a black and white shooter, by converting all the images to gray scale. But I found the grayscale to be very unsatisfying. Good results good be had, but it took a lot of work and a lot of time to get there. It was much faster just to process the images as color.

    But now that I am doing color, I like RAW. Yes, it always needs processing but there have been some images that I absolutely would have lost had I shot them on color slide film due to exposure mishaps but that I know have – including what I believe will be one of my top ten legacy images after I have passed on. That image would have been forever lost had I made the same mistake with it on slide film – on print film as well. But now it is beautiful and, even to me, amazing to look it and contemplate.

    You can say, be careful and precise in the first place and that kind of thing won’t happen, but sometimes live moves quick and chaotic and we make mistakes. RAW can be the life-saver.

    Thodoris – a pleasure.

    Eva – that will be a treasure.

  113. Frostfrog
    Actually, shooting slides has it’s own tedium. While it is true that a projected site is a joy to behold, organizing a slide projector and a dark room can be an issue. If you avoid projecting originals then even that is not possible, and viewing and editing takes place on a light table squinting through a loupe. I’ve got some pretty good loupes, but compared to viewing photos on a good monitor it is pretty un-satisfactory. There is no going back.

  114. THODORIS thanks for the list much appreciated

    ROSS it is great meandering read

    EVA the accordion books are all hand made translation into print just doesn’t work as they lose their tactile nature. Some images find their way into the other books.

  115. books.. books.. books..

    and magazines printed on paper good enough to not see the shadow of the image on the following page.. in the UK i had many hundreds.. a wall in my studio home.. a steady stream of them sent monthly from clients and potential clients for more than 10 years..

    when i emigrated the relief, (the bitter joy), of “unloading” was palpable.. and the recycling center which devoured them adored me..
    just could not afford moving them this time.

    the plasticity of a photo back-lit on screen just doesn’t get the same rise out of me.
    mcdonalds may have it’s place, yet a steak would always be my preference… i’m cooking steaks over and over.. blue to rare is best and getting the temperature right for that’s at the forefront of my mind.. has been for years..

    so much about the internet leaves me feeling under-nourished.. wanting..
    photos and characters and music and fads..
    solidity and the object..
    the table at the pub beats skype conversation..
    the compact disk pisses on the mp3
    and a book eats chunks out of my laptop.

  116. a civilian-mass audience

    I just returned from a big carnaval…we have Apokries (Halloween) in Greece…
    everything is broken…but not the spirit…
    I blended ouzo,beer,raki…
    and HOT,HOT civilians dancing like there is no tomorrow…oime…
    Everything is hot…books,i-pads,civilians,souvlakia…HOT and BURNing…!!!

    P.S …I will start to read your comments…I hope I finish soon:)))
    BURN my BURNIANS!!! MR.HARVEY are you ready for Rio?!!!!!!!

  117. Just wanted to share with all…

    Along with tortilla chips, beer bottles, band-aids etc…Throw into the light modifier hat: the paper wrapper from a Lea & Perrins Worcestershire sauce bottle! Works great!


  118. a civilian-mass audience

    DB…game over…!
    homeless BURNIAN…looking for home…
    I need a photo to go with the caption…

    the winner will receive a bottle(miniature) of extra virgin olive…all organic:)))
    ok,back to my reading…hmmm

    MICHAELK…bravo…so,do you blend the sauce with the wrapper…hmmm… do you need a waterproof camera to throw the mix…no need to reply…just wondering out loud…

    Evolution…REVOLUTION…to all…be strong my Libyan friends…
    we Greeks will follow…

  119. Frostfrog/Bill…
    Yes I agree ACR has many merits I have also saved many images with it. Its just I am a rebel and I like to Choose between using it or not. At the moment shooting digital I am obliged to go into ACR or photoshop to get something decent out of my dsII files.

  120. A couple more links from the hundreds out there:

    For distribution:
    Artists’ Books Cooperative


    small/independent publishers:


    amazing production quality

    they have just released their first (very affordable) little book which is nicely done


    they’re not exactly publishers, but they do publish 1 to 3 books per year from the work submitted to their Critical Mass competition

  121. Thodoris…
    OK Thanks! But what are YOUR favourite books? My question was directed to you and all Burnians personal favourites. :)

  122. I’ve only got 3… weak year for me
    Sally Mann – The flesh and the spirit.
    Keith Carter -Fireflies.
    OK this one isn’t new but somehow lost it in 2009 without even looking through it and I stumbled on it in Dec.. Kaylynn Deveney – The day to day life of Albert Hastings. And it’s brilliant!


    welcome back here amigo….been missing your wisdom…..no , game not over in june….we are working now to add many interesting elements to the pot between now and june , so we would not do that if there were to be no more Burn…i might just have to turn the day to day running of Burn over to others so that i may finish some of my work..

    cheers, david

  124. Top ten photobooks 2010? No idea, as I don’t know in which year the books I bought last year came out.. and I don’t really have top, my meter to measure would be if I would buy them again.. and sometimes one or two pictures in a book to me are worth the whole book.. plus it changes, depending on mood, need and state of mind..

  125. Eva…
    Well I suppose I sort of wrote 10 automatically without thinking it over…
    Favourite photobook you purchased in 2010?
    You are lucky :)! I find it very hard to enjoy a book with only two or three images in it I like.

  126. Paul.. favourite.. don’t know.. but the one that has made me appreciate different photographic styles that are different from what I’m instinctively drawn to, and therefore opened my mind most, is without doubt burn.01..

    And then, just looking at my shelves.. there are so many.. yikes.. insane how many I have.. Ackerman’s Half Life, Axelsson’s Faces of the North, Salgado’s Other Americas, Bazan’s Passing Through.. too too many to choose a top..

    Imants: that is one photographic ‘book’ I happily skip..

  127. a civilian-mass audience

    my favourite is BURN03…cause I like threes…
    three is the first lucky prime number…

  128. a civilian-mass audience

    oime…new essay…hmmm…where is JIM…:)))

    and My BURNIANS…up on my screen…I can see my name on the left and a search box on the right…
    did we have that before…hmmm…I better check my glasses…

  129. Eva, ” sometimes one or two pictures in a book to me are worth the whole book.. ” yes, I bought Koudelka’s Gypsies for the cover photograph. Liked the rest of the book but I had to have the cover photograph.


  130. As a child, and if Dad’s budget afforded it, we would spend a week at a rented cottage in various parts of Ontario’s resort area. When I was ten or eleven, returning from one of these vacations, we stopped at a house in a remote forest; after a few minutes inside, Dad returned to the car with a few cardboard boxes. At home he presented us with a collection of 200 National Geographic magazines; in a way, they were my first photo-books.

    I was able to roam the world literally at my fingertips with this collection – even undersea and outer space. This was the late sixties and I was connected to the world by these magazines of photographs similar to the way I am now interconnected via the Internet. How lucky I was – in the sense that not every child had such a library – that I could learn about archaeology, anthropology, natural history and cutting-edge science. What a database! I would cut out photos from the magazines to glue to my school essays; sometimes in fact, my essays would be built around the photographs. Over the years as my interests changed, I could always rely on the National Geographic collection for at least cursory information. Who knows how those early sparks led to further, deeper pursuits of wisdom later?

    When we’re asked if paper is hot, I look upon it it in a McLuhanistic way – is it a “hot” medium, or not? Looking at it in the sensory/participation paradigm, the answer is not discrete, but relative. Is it hotter than an e-book? The tactile nature of reading/handling a book requires more participation from the user in a physical sense – at rest and at leisure – but an e-book can be read anywhere, anytime. The degree of user participation is on a another plane, and could be considered equal but different.

    The sensory impact is similar but different also. We can share an ebook with others easier; we can enlarge the images to our satisfaction on screen (unlike a painting, a photograph doesn’t have a fixed size – visual impact changes with size). I find the question quite full, as the degree of sensation and participation seems to flow back and forth between the two mediums.

    One thing is for sure though; I now no longer cut out photos from my photo-books. I make my own photos…and that may be just the latest legacy from my first photo-books.

  131. Mike..

    Methinks you have another edition of ‘Gypsies’ than mine then, I got a tiny little picture on the cover.. wouldn’t have bought the book for that alone :)

    All that talk about books and Cristina Garcia Rodero and her work on traditions and rituals have made me go in the darkroom and start to print some negatives that were there since a couple years http://www.slowemotion.it/home.htm .. and now I’d like to go back and take more pictures.. uff..

  132. Eva, it is the portrait of an elderly man, holding a large coin and a photograph of himself as a young man. It is a small photograph but I love it. It captures the passage of time. The introduction on the inner sleeve is by Robert Delpire and dated 1975. There is a larger version of the photograph in the book proper but I love the smaller version.



  133. a civilian-mass audience

    VIVA EVA…take a glass of wine with you…
    hmm…I don’t know…can you photographers drink in the darkromm…???

  134. Mike.. same as mine then..

    Civi.. can’t take the wine with me.. YOU have the best.. what should I drink?? no darkroom for a week.. crossing borders tomorrow.. not waters though..

  135. OH EVA!!!!
    Brilliant. When will you create a book or an essay so we can all be blown away by your photography? Quietly and steadily always forward.

  136. a civilian-mass audience

    EVA is crossing borders…
    not the BURNING waters
    PAUL is waiting for her book
    editing his photos…
    DAH is crossing borders too
    oime,MY BURNIANS…we are going south…:)))

    yeap, EVA…I have the best wine in my broken Grecolandia…

  137. a civilian-mass audience

    Tonight,I followed the twitty’s words:
    “You notice brilliant philosophers in every pub? Smartest people on the planet seem to hang towards end of the bar…”
    I was sitting towards the end…I returned back home…I did the IQ test…nothing,zero nada…
    same results…maybe worse…:)
    I don’t give up…I am a fighter like YOU my BURNIANS…
    as PAUL says… “Quietly and steadily always forward.”
    keep rolling…

    P.S I am looking forward for MR.HARVEY’S traveling through Universe…
    cause I will be able to sing …(to be perceived as a joke):)))

  138. harvey..

    if wisdom were in me i’d be a better man..
    i’ve just tried to be be confident following my plentiful mistakes..

    while away from the internet i’ve been working hard.. saved and got a flatbed to finally contact-scan everything.. all negatives, all projects.. about 35% done after a month.. maybe 25 000 done.. unsure.

    between that, being a pappa and working on a portrait of the island where we live, time has just evaporated.. also beginning to edit down the personal / impersonal work i have done since emigrating 3 years ago.. have a couple of book ideas evolving.
    being away from the internet is recommended.

    on magazines –

    i liked the layout and format of the magazines i worked for.. was like getting books of similar layout through the post monthly, yet with wildly varying content.. the way “satellites” and “infidel”.. or .. ‘concerned photographer” and “burn01” share a common size and layout, with differing subject matter…

    i’d always skim read once or twice before settling in, and personally i don’t do that with the web.. it’s a one hit wonder.. a single pass, MTV style disposable experience with links and references leading elsewhere. hours drift by on the internet and new things bombard..

    for me, relaxation and recuperation happens much easier with a book or magazine.. with the internet there is a constant “click-through, consume” which leaves me a bit .. wired?

    quite apart from the tactile nature of the things, the comfort from familiarity of form, books and magazines become more fascinating as time passes..
    websites are deleted when old, magazines ferment.
    i remember giving you a vintage copy of natgeo with some of your spanish work that i picked up in bergen.. the adverts, articles.. also the form and formula of magazines repeats over time and can be a source of ideas.

    on books –
    as others have said, they are for the most part transient. i’ve never hung on to reading material – only photo books.. although i am not a collector of them. i buy what i like, yet have a healthy suspicion that if i over subscribe to them the influence of other photographers could bleed into my work.
    i tend to go through bursts of gorging on them.. just coming out of a year of doing just that now and beginning to not want to see more. working too much on my own thing right now and want to keep my influences firmly in the “real” surroundings i have, rather than the fine efforts of others.

    i still find the work of others interesting.. an interesting distraction though.. my favorite work is my own and the greatest influences are the people and experience in my own life.. i want to keep it that way and i’m sensitive to the work of others.. so i enjoy books then leave them.

    for example.. i got around to looking at sobols “sabine” recently.. loved it.. now trying to forget it..

    ramble, ramble.

  139. BOB BLACK
    David…..lastly: you were in a dream last night…
    BOB!!!!You are luckier than me.

    Last I told David he was in one of my dreams, he found it bizarre/weird (well, that’s the stuff of dream, David, weirdness…) asked me what I had been smoking, stop smoking it and have a hot glass of milk before bedtime. I was not even…;-)…. pestering him as you did, just had him chuckling at a joke while he directed a WS. I was basically totally unobtrusive in my very own dream.

    I have now filed a petition to my subconscious to suppress any vision of David in my dreams, and for that matter, while I was at it, any vision of…. Bob Black too! :-)))))))))))

  140. a civilian-mass audience

    and the Oscar goes to Banksy…!!!

    P.S.thanks for everything…credit where credit is due…!!!

  141. DAH:
    as in all art it is generally those who have received remuneration for their efforts who have indeed historically done the very best work….
    David, I agree totally with you that the pressure of having to submit, or having to get to it, can produce the best work/art. But there are countless examples of artists who went about creating great art without the promise of remuneration. Van Gogh, Schubert, Rimbaud, etc… Closer to us, Shostakovich who lived under Staline censorship created a lot of what is now considered his greatest testimony to the music of the 20th century (preludes and fugues for piano, quatuors), on the side of the commissions the “Party” asked of him.

    Maybe I misunderstood what you meant, or maybe it is going to far back in time with my examples. It would indeed seem that nowadays, one has in some ways have to find some spot in the “market place” to get a chance at recognition.

  142. a civilian-mass audience

    February 28, 2011 at 1:47 am
    David…..lastly: you were in a dream last night…
    BOB!!!!You are luckier than me.

    I second HERVE…!!!

  143. David Bowen…

    “yet have a healthy suspicion that if i over subscribe to them the influence of other photographers could bleed into my work…
    for example.. i got around to looking at sobols “sabine” recently.. loved it.. now trying to forget it..”

    I find your thoughts on books being too much of an influence very interesting! I have long had the suspicion that my photography books are not the healthiest of influences on me either.

  144. a civilian-mass audience

    you were in a dream last nigh…a BURNING one…where are you BURNIANSSSS?!!

  145. To learn how to play an instrument…just as an example Blues, probably the best way to find a personal style is to begin learning the licks, riffs and phrases of other musicians. Hopefully when one has learnt a sufficient amount of licks you can then start to improvise and with a little bit of luck your own “voice” will begin to emerge…
    Countless times I remember going into the National Gallery as a kid at school and seeing students copying the works of the masters…skill gets imprinted through the action.
    I´ve heard of a novelist who taught himself the craft of fiction by retyping the stories of his favourite authors.
    These are all ways of honing ones skills in order to create but as David Bowen mentions reading photography books does not seem to have the same positive effect.

  146. a civilian-mass audience

    I am in again…back to work…we Europeans suffer…:)))

    Be safe my BURNIANS…especially those who will attend carnivals…
    oime…I have been warned…not to get attached to the photophilosophers…

    “Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.”
    T.S. Eliot

  147. http://www.banksy.co.uk/shop/index.html



    nobody ever seen his face…and gives his art for free…couple years ago almost got arrested and his identity revealed when he visited the Disneyland in LA and put an inflated doll in the amusement park…
    the doll it was an “imitation” of a Guantanamo Bay prisoner wearing the typical orange suit and a black mask in his head…
    Banksy is like Robin Hood…or Zorro…
    He almost got the Oscar award for best documentary last night in LA Oscar ceremony…he was competing with RESTREPO (also a nominee ) although the final winner was a documentary about wall street…
    How “they” ruined american economy, destroyed europe, and nobody ever got punished..
    think Goldman Sachs, Lehman Brothers, JPMorgan Chase and all those scum backs…

    please ALL “discover” the BEST STREET ARTIST OF ALL TIMES:
    BANKSY….see the documentary….

  148. Banksy was most probably in the auditorium but nobody ever knew his real name, nobody knows how he looks like…no gallery ever represent him and his street art is sold for millions in the black market….
    if u think Andy Warhol was cool….then u never discovered Banksy…
    the total mystery man…THE BEST ARTIST BORN EVER…

  149. NY Times today:


    “I’m not an activist, an alarmist, a Democrat, environmentalist or anything like that. I’m just a person who isn’t able to manage the health of my family because of all this drilling.”
    KELLY GANT, whose says her children have had severe asthma attacks and headaches since a gas well was set up near her house in Bartonville, Tex.

  150. a civilian-mass audience

    PANOS…BANKTSY won the Oscar…here in BURNLAND…
    I guess you were sleeping:)))

    a civilian-mass audience
    February 28, 2011 at 1:55 am
    and the Oscar goes to Banksy…!!!
    P.S.thanks for everything…credit where credit is due…!!!

    POMARA…where have you been..MR.Higher Education?!!BRAVO for your book!
    I am waiting for my BBQ…!

    BRAVO to my ANTONNNN…!!!

    BURNIANS you are all amazing…BRAVOHARVEY!!!

  151. a civilian-mass audience

    ok,back to our regular programe…2 chickens gone…I needed protein…oups:)
    I will be back…

  152. News from the British Journal of Photography: Leica and Magnum collaboration


    DAH, perhaps you can get Leica to produce an M camera with viewfinder that allows the user to see the frame lines whilst wearing spectacles. The current viewfinder dates from the 1950s.

    Are you Leica collaborating with the Rio story David? Hope so, let us know how you find the reliability of the M9 please. I’m using Leica film: I did have an M8 but didn’t get on with it. The body depth is deeper than the film M and I found myself holding it between finger and thumb like a point and shoot!

    Perhaps I should ask Anton?



  153. I think it’s a “horses for courses” situation whether you can be over-influenced by other’s work. I’ve found it extremely beneficial to see a wide variety of work (book, web) because it has opened my eyes to the sheer diversity of photographic work.

    It may be different if you’ve been brought up in an art-filled home; or maybe attended an art school where you have been exposed to many types of work.

    Viewing a wide variety of work also gives you the confidence to try something different in your own work because your sense of the art/photographic world has been widened. Slavishly copying another’s work is definitely a dead end road though. Just my 2c worth! :-)

  154. Ross…
    That isn’t 2c worth! More like 1000 dollars like all burn!
    I think you are right one must keep everything in perspective. Here where I live and probably like you it’s all very far removed…the world of Magnum and all the greats and I need the books and the web to keep up. Necessary to keep inspired. But it is funny since i’ve been reading Emerald Isle i’ve noticed my images are very busy, crowded with various layers! I suppose as long as I am aware of it everything is in control :)

  155. I find the work of others very helpful. [both the work I love and the work I am disdainful of]
    Why does this picture make me feel this way?
    why am I drawn to it? [or, obviously, the converse]
    What fantastic tonality…How is that realised? Why do I find it fantastic?
    Does it fit with what I want to say in a picture, now or later?

    LEITER …..al[ and so many more]l have taught me invaluable lessons
    A way of saying what I want/need to say……NOT a way of copying what someone else has already said!
    Your life is YOUR LIFE!, and it absolutely determines how you reflect in the mirror.
    Being true to that mirror is my goal.
    A picture of a tree, or a street or a face….they all reflect YOU! USE THAT!
    Do not try to be a D’agata if you are not, he is as most likely as covetous of your position as you his.
    BE YOURSELF. and reflect that in your work. At least then, if nothing else, you are honest.

    Panos. yes that is robin. Is it such a big deal? I have known him for years and he is just a man….dont make legends of people.

  156. Panos. yes that is robin. Is it such a big deal? I have known him for years and he is just a man…

    damn….John i envy you :)

  157. Ross, i agree…but its hard (impossible for me at least) to deny Banksy’s tremendous talent..
    Im not a graffiti artist nor im aiming to be one…but but the guy totally inspires me to the fullest!

  158. Panos. You should be inspired. He is a fasntastic artist. His sense of satire is tremendous…..and behind the whole mask thing he does the right thing with his ……assests. Just believe that despite the quoted prices and the hype, he has not sold out.

  159. “a bit of pragmatism colliding with passion”

    I agree; that’s a pretty good combination, and usually produces an outcome. Much better than the person who should really work as a gunner in the Navy.. You know? “Gunna do this, gunna do that” but really prefers to talk about it, rather than starting anything. :-)

  160. All, here is the docu made directed by Banksy nominated for Oscar yesterday:


    btw, its streaming free through netflix (for USA)

    “Amateur filmmaker Thierry Guetta’s project to chronicle the underground world of street art takes a fascinating twist when he meets Banksy , an elusive British stencil artist, in this Oscar nominated documentary.

    Cast: Banksy-Shepard Fairey-Thierry Guetta
    Director: Banksy

  161. Mike R, (although a rangefinder and definitely an M8 fanatic),
    i still believe that ANY camera is a GREAT camera…
    most dentists own M8, M9’s etc…. and nothing comes out right as u know!

  162. “I´ve heard of a novelist who taught himself the craft of fiction by retyping the stories of his favourite authors.”


    That was Henry Miller wasn’t it? (Or maybe Kerouac?) (Nah, I’m going with Miller.)

  163. Michael K, nice one. Panos, last I heard you were shooting M8: is that still the case?

    Perhaps you should start a wedding present list, you know; toaster, M9, towels, M9, etc.


  164. a civilian-mass audience

    Don’t we All love it…when our BURNIANS are starting…the tongue in the cheek thing…

    damnit…we should call this place…BRAVOBURN…:)))

  165. I think that the Leica / Magnum partnership is a good thing. Anything that promotes rangefinder cameras to photographers and gives Leica real-world feedback of their products in the field must be beneficial.

    And Panos, yes; the best camera in the world is the one you have with you!

    Good light mate,


  166. Michael, Paul:
    “I´ve heard of a novelist who taught himself the craft of fiction by retyping the stories of his favourite authors.”

    The amazing Donald Ray Pollock for certain.

  167. MikeR.. great idea.. Although the way I shoot is pretty much M8 compatible..
    M9 wouldn’t change anything except from putting me in extra debt double sizing my files and cutting my harddrives capacity in half…
    I mean really.. But I wouldn’t say no to a second , second hand M8…
    although I never had to do any repairs or even clean it.. Exposed to beach sand million times..
    Tons of corona (and recently some vodka) on it.. No sweat..
    Only a Toyota camry could be as reliable…
    No bull.. No advertisement ..:)

  168. HERVE…you….the BURNing bag…last year…:)))))))))))))))

    David was happy for me, but thinks my winning caption was not that good! No wonder I leave him alone in my dreams…. :-))))

  169. Michael Kircher and Windup…
    I don´t know about Kerouc or Miller but Raymond Chandler believed Hemingway to be the greatest American novelist of his time, and he wrote imitations of Hemingway´s style to absorb what he loved about it. Proust went further, spending twelve years translating and annotating the writing of John Rushkin. He also wrote a series of articles for Le Figaro imitating the styles of such nineteenth century figures as Balzac and Flaubert.

    BTW Michael… yes Allard and Hemingway are a good fit. Anymore photographers whose style can be likened to be writers?

  170. a civilian-mass audience

    MR.HARVEY…may the spirits…blah,blah,blah…

    mice can wait …to play
    countdown begins now…
    one hour …two hours…three hours…

    I guess…I am the cat…:)))))))))))))))))

    P.S PAUL…I see Spanish influence…damnit…we rock…!!!

  171. a civilian-mass audience

    and after play time…please, can you bring some of those HOT pictures of yours…
    I am prepared now…
    I promised wine to my guy in the pharmacy…he promised to bring me my prescription
    (high blood pressure)…

  172. a civilian-mass audience

    where is FRAMERS…her birthday is coming up…oime…you are so many…

  173. a civilian-mass audience

    MICHAELK…according to my calendar…he has 30 more years to go…:)

  174. a civilian-mass audience

    I use the Ancient ,Athenian Greek calendar…;)

    PAUL…65 Strat…wooo

    “Wanted:Digi assistant Rio de Janeiro. Now. Long hours, low pay, and very best time of your life. Guaranteed. Leave message Burn Magazine.Rio ”

    Damnit,I qualify But I just can’t leave my chickens…:))))))))))))))))

    ok,enough,I will be back…

  175. a civilian-mass audience

    to be accurate…you are 23 and 7 months…
    Running like BOBBY


  176. Michael K.,

    Thanks for the Telecaster link! I got to Springsteen’s Tele at the Rock ‘n Roll Hall of Fame – I’ve never seen a guitar with more honest wear… Where’s Rossy at? He’s a Tele lover…


    I’m envious! (Mine’s a ’99 or ’00 MIM Telecaster, but I can’t play worth a damn :-)

  177. Justin…
    The secret is PRACTICE! Started at the age of 8 and by the age of 14 I was practising before going into school, lunchtime break and after school. Was averaging easily 6 hours a day, sounds like a lot but by the age of 20 when I was teaching music I was practising or studying about 10 hours daily.
    But no more thanks! 12 years teaching at school and at home privately burnt me out, had lots of great students but somehow everything just sucked the life out of my love for the guitar.

  178. Gordon…
    Yes very true! I won´t fall in the trap twice!
    Above all I am out to enjoy the whole concept of photography something that I lost with music. Keep getting phone calls asking for music lessons but no thanks.
    Every so often I go out on to my front porch in the afternoon and play until it´s dark just a beer and either my Les Paul or one of my acoustics and I do recover for awhile the magic.
    Still can just about play this while the sun is going down :)

  179. mice can wait …to play
    and dream in the meantime! ;-)

    Guitars…. I owned over a dozen, still 5 left, but I am still crying about selling my Les Paul Goldtop 1956, years, er, decades ago. One of the silliest things i ever done. Prize possessions are a Gibson ES-175 (1955), and a 1966 orange hollow body GRETSCH.

  180. if i were not running to the airport right now , i would go into my really poor harmonica playing..good to jam with guitar though …and the later in the evening and the more wine consumed etc the better i can jam..the good thing about a harmonica is that it goes at the bottom of any camera bag….ok nuf said..bye til Rio…

  181. Found this while reading…
    Perhaps Hemingway´s finest demonstration of short sentence prowess was when he was challenged to tell an entire story in only 6 words:
    “For sale: baby shoes, never used.”

  182. Keith Richard’s Micawber is THE one! :-) First guitar on the page. Now that is road worn! Not the faux fancy-pants brand new pre-road worn!


    David; Yip; can’t beat a blues harp in the bottom of the pack. Funny; I taught myself to play cross harp by using the wrong harmonica. Bought a G harp and the shop put a C inside by mistake.

    So… tried to play along to a Muddy Waters song in G and it didn’t work by blowing, so sucked and it sounded right. In other words; taught myself how to play cross harp by mistake! My skill level still sucks though! :-)

  183. Hi all. back after some time out!
    “(…)are we seeing the end of the printed book game?”
    Guess we’ve been here before…”The End of Print” – from my last visit. Interesting topic…

    As far as I can tell, print is not dead…it’s shifting…from mass to specialty, from large runs to short runs. Small publishers arise, and they are also driven by the ubiquity of the internet. It´s the born global phenomena.

    Small thing apart from subject…

    It’s not just print. ;)


  184. “Guess we’ve been here before…”The End of Print” – from my last visit. Interesting topic…” overstatement, sorry…it’s just that i remember.

  185. a civilian-mass audience

    Welcome back RODOLFOOOOO…

    and to My Rio BURNIANS…please, take care of our MR.HARVEY…he even plays harmonica…
    oime…what else…:)))


  186. a civilian-mass audience

    Today…1st of MARCH …I was thinking to make it…( a suggestion)


    I need more names…my memory is getting weak…but all of you(u know your names)…behind the tent…

    “We tend to forget that happiness doesn’t come as a result of getting something we don’t have, but rather of recognizing and appreciating what we do have.”

    you may not have a Leica M9 or M10…or a trendy lens…
    you may not have THE “pics” of the year
    you may not won any awards…
    you have…( I am not gonna make it easy for you)
    each one of you…I repeat,YOU HAVE what you have that you know that you Have…

    P.S Now,we have to figure out …the Appreciation day for MR.DAVID ALAN HARVEY…

  187. a civilian-mass audience

    I really appreciate it…

    and now we can all try to donate…hmmm…
    I wonder why paypal doesn’t accept…my old drachmas
    well…we can try…

    P.S EVAAAAAA…where is EVA tonight? she knows what to do?

  188. a civilian-mass audience

    ok…goodnight from Grecolandia…

    I know…I am all over…my apologies
    MR.DAH said that the mice can play…therefore I accepted my role…
    I am a civilian…and I do as I told…
    BRAVOBURN…pouf all clear

  189. a civilian-mass audience

    I was calling for my Africans friends…now they are here…
    I will be in and out
    RED CROSS is calling…
    I am a civilian…
    with the a mission…

    i love you ALL…I will be back
    keep BURN on fire…
    I hope MR.HARVEY and the other BURNIANS are safe in Rio…

    no ouzo for me today…but Viva anyways…!!!

  190. john g..

    do you know why jockyslut and sleezenation folded?
    i only lost a few hundred when they went out of business.. a colleague lost a couple of grand..

  191. Hey David, do you still need an assistant in Rio?… I have sent you a private email, I am not sure if you get them or read them on a constant basis though… Best wishes from Bogota

  192. ALL..

    for those of you trying to find me, i have just been on a 10 hour flight..just arrived Rio…met by two beautiful twin sisters..best arrival of all time….no time to write now…first things first

  193. You know, I dont go anywhere where beautiful twin sisters meet me. In fact, I dont even go anywhere where an evil old crone wishes that my liver would rot and I die of leporsy meets me. I just dont hang around in the right circles, I guess.

  194. Hmm.. I arrived too.. but no twin sisters here either.. must be doing something wrong.. ;))

    Skimming through comments.. hi Rodolfo!.. Civi.. what should I know.. I don’t know anything.. more tea for you??

  195. As i sat quietly waiting my turn to get another X-ray on my foot i took advantage of the very good wifi at my local hospital this morning. I managed to get wade through 15 pages of google searching for a decently priced Bruce Davidson’s “Outside inside”. The cheapest i found was 280 euros and the average price was around 400 euros. Top price was a first edition like all the others! going for 1,200 euros or dollars. Mad!! :)))

  196. Believe it or not, I can actually draw.
    Jean-Michel Basquiat

    I am not a black artist, I am an artist.
    Jean-Michel Basquiat

    I don’t listen to what art critics say. I don’t know anybody who needs a critic to find out what art is.
    Jean-Michel Basquiat

    I don’t think about art when I’m working. I try to think about life.
    Jean-Michel Basquiat

    I had some money, I made the best paintings ever. I was completely reclusive, worked a lot, took a lot of drugs. I was awful to people.
    Jean-Michel Basquiat

    I start a picture and I finish it.
    Jean-Michel Basquiat

    I thought I was going to be a bum the rest of my life.
    Jean-Michel Basquiat

  197. All this book talking/making has inspired me to sort of create a daily diary of images of my kids day to day mixed in with local and world news. Kind of thing when they are round 30 years old they may smile and appreciate.

  198. Panos…
    Seems all the fun is in Rio! All day out yesterday without commenting on here thought i would find the usual great stuff and surprised to find very few comments!

  199. Paul..:)
    Exactly… I should be in rio and I’m pissed coz I already had been booked for the next 4 weeks non stop..
    Los Angeles is very demanding and I have to stay in my territory ..
    (I cover the area all the way from Malibu to marina del rey and as north as the mullholand drive..
    That means drive on the 405 freeway..NOT FUN

  200. a civilian-mass audience

    PAUL…you are right…I just came back and where is the party??????????

    EVA…I forgot what I was talking about…but I am sending over twin brothers…
    they are working for Red Cross…and they know little Italian…
    Do they qualify…:)))))))

  201. a civilian-mass audience


    Los Angeles is very demanding…hmmm…
    then,come back to Grecia,
    where the wine is red
    and the people are hot…
    hmmm…I am lying..:(((


  202. Well we’ve got to be very grateful for this site…very special. Somehow i find it difficult to imagine Cormack McCarthy or Stephen King or any other top writer creating a site for the next generation! Can you imagine such a thing…?!?!

  203. Civi… Sorry but I’ll take 405 traffic anytime over grecolandia ..
    405 is hectic but grecia???? Painful..
    I can’t stomach grecia.. That’s Nachtwey territory ..
    Not mine.. I’m definitely more of a Rio guy..
    Plus I missed the beautiful innocent LA swinger parties…:)
    Viva Venice Beach

  204. a civilian-mass audience

    PAUL…how is the weather in Spain…
    When is your carnaval time…?
    here in Greece …the party started…
    but it’s feels weird…
    my fellow Grecocivilians are looking …freezed…

    BUT you are right…”WE’VE GOT TO BE GRATEFUL …” …
    BURN is the place to be…

  205. a civilian-mass audience

    PANOS…oime…sad,sad,sad stories…
    we Greeks got to do it…I don’t know what…
    BUT we need REVOLUTION…now…

    well,I don’t know about Rio…BUT I am Venice civilian for sure…
    viva Italy…!!!

  206. Well my wife says it is cold here…i can’t give my opinon i generally do’t suffer with the cold. Sunday we had 7 degrees celcius with a lot of rain. My kids dressed up for carnival last Friday.

  207. a civilian-mass audience

    hmmm…I guess, we are talking about Venice…Venich Beach in California…:)))

    that’s what happens…when I don’t eat olive oil for 4 days…I can’t focus.

    IMANTS…doi knia

  208. Rebels in Libya Win Battle but Fail to Loosen Qaddafi’s Grip
    From the feeble cover of sand dunes, assaulted by a warplane and artillery from a hill, rebels repelled an attack by Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi’s fighters.

  209. Qaddafis Fought Over Business, Cables Show
    American diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks describe how two sons of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi fought, brutally, for control of a local Coca-Cola bottling company.

    NYTimes today

  210. a civilian-mass audience

    7C…yeap…it’s cold for me…
    your wife is definitely Med…
    I can’t stand cold( FROSTFROG VIVA)…as I said here before…I always follow the sun…

    Carnival here in Greece all week long…12 degrees in my place
    but no big parties…the times are changing…this year I can feel it…
    my civilians are not in the mood…

  211. Steve Jobs Returns to Introduce a New iPad
    Apple’s chief executive interrupted a medical leave to introduce the much-anticipated new tablet.

    NYTimes today


    “You feel punched in the stomach.”
    ERIN PARKER, a high school science teacher in Madison, Wis., on verbal jabs against teachers.

    NYTimes today

  213. ON THIS DAY
    On March 3, 1991, in a case that sparked a national outcry, motorist Rodney King was severely beaten by Los Angeles police officers in a scene captured on amateur video.
    • See This Front Page NYT

  214. a civilian-mass audience


    can we say F**ck…3 times in the same page…?

    P.S …I have no problem but I don’t speak English either…:)))

  215. And big fuck u to the Feds that are trying to close our medical marijuana dispensaries in Venice..
    “we” citizens of California voted and decided..
    State Law let u carry up to a pound of mary Jane in your car but the Feds disagree..
    Defend venice, defend gay rights, defend the immigrants and FUCK ARIZONA..
    and Arizona Hitler law that give the authority to any brainless cop to ask a Hispanic looking immigrant for green card..etc.. This is a violation..
    Arizona , America wake up.. “they” are slowly taking our rights away…

  216. a civilian-mass audience

    PANOS…tell it like it is…I would love to second everything
    ADMIN says…not to use the F**ck word….hmmm:(

    REVOLUTION,EVOLUTION…BURN the Universe down !!!

  217. a civilian-mass audience

    So photographers what do you think…?

    hmmm…how DAH can do this…so hard to find inspiring questions …for years and years…
    geez…he is like Asterix and Ovelix…he might have the magic potion…


  218. a civilian-mass audience

    “Bulls make money and bears make money, but pigs seldom do”

  219. O.k. DAH is away so we mice can play: so here’s my question to you all. In the vein of Panos’ argument that civil liberties are being eroded (in his case by the Feds) where do you stand with this scenario that happened to me last week.
    We had a foggy evening so I drove down to a local senior school that has open air sports courts that are floodlit in the winter months. I didn’t know if they would be in use or if the players would be male, female, child or adult: it turned out that it was male junior football (soccer) practice. I took a few overview photographs from the car park but when I moved up to the court fence I was told that I couldn’t take photographs of the players, that no-one could take photographs – not even a parent unless every parent agreed.
    “The world has gone mad” I said, “They’re just kids playing football”. The irony is that the boys would have been rendered as b&w silhouettes against the fog and floodlight. They would have been foreground interest.
    I came away understanding the concerns of the parents but feeling sad for the children who had to play in a floodlit pen protected by their parents. When I was a kid we used to play on a field with coats for goalposts and only go home when we could no-longer see the ball.


  220. Mike…
    It´s absolutely mad the whole idea. However sometimes I´ve got a feeling it´s even worse over here in Spain.
    I´ve just signed a note giving permission to allow a university student to take a couple of images of my son and his classmates. This girl who´s been the whole winter´s term in the school classroom helping out the official teacher and learning what it really means to be with twenty five little five year old kids as part of her degree. These images will be presented in her university report/essay/thesis for the end of year evaluation. I find it little pathetic to sign this note if I have been already trusting her for the last five months without any problem. Anyway it´s only a couple of bloody photos, she isn´t asking to take images without her clothes on!!

  221. Michael Kircher…
    The other day you quite correctly chose William Albert Allard and DAH as the Hemingways of the world of photography.
    Which photographer would you choose who has a similar style to John Steinbeck narrative? Obviously in could never be HCB to distant and removed from his subjects…

    “Steinbeck’s decriptions are rich and detailed and he utilizes adjectives that give a description to everything. The dialect between characters draws a picture of how the characters speak instead of just what they say. All in all, Steinbeck’s greatest utensil in his writings is the diction. A real empathy for his characters”

    Bruce Davidson or perhaps Eugene Richards?

  222. a civilian-mass audience


    REF: your question.

    When I was kid(long time ago)I was playing football(soccer) and like you I have the same memories…
    here in Grecolandia nothing have changed…so come over…:)))
    no pictures of civi though…your camera will burst into flames

    PAUL…yes…Blissful thinking!!!

  223. Mike.. it’s the same over here.. I was taking pictures at a fencing tournament, of an athlete interacting with schoolchildren been brought there for showing them what this fencing stuff was all about.. and the teachers insisted I take no pictures.. I took them anyway, they were at a public event, and I know parents here sign a paper at the beginning of every school year that they allow for kids doing this kind of activity..

    I don’t know about the UK, but over here if more than 5 (I think) people are in a picture nobody can argue.. and you can always take the picture, the problem might be showing it.. it’s nuts in any case..

  224. Civi, yes, childhood memories. When we were bored as kids someone would suggest knocking on Old Man Johnson’s door (knock-a-door-run). The usual response would be “F**k off, not him”! After some teasing someone would knock on his door and out he’d come, with a stick, shouting something like “You little bastards, just wait till I get my hands on you” …. and off we’d run; and so would he, chasing you all evening until you snuck home in the dark.
    The problem was; next day you would be playing football on the field and suddenly everyone would be running away! You turn around and there he is: Old Man Johnson, and his stick! He would chase you for a week!

    When I was older I realised that he could have just told my Dad (Gravy Jim) and …. end-of: Jim would have told my Mum and she would of given me a slap. Jim was not allowed to hit me because my Mum said that he wasn’t home enough to hit his kids (spent more time in the pub (laughing)).

    I reckon that Old Man Johnson was as bored we were and just enjoyed the chase! You’ve got to love that man Civi.


  225. Eva, I’ve been taking photographs for over 35 years and have only had two objections. Ironically on both occasions the human element was only a small part of the frame.
    Generally, if you are upfront and confident with your actions i.e. obviously comfortable about what you are doing then no-one usually has a problem. I’ve started to carry a few prints in my camera bag as ice-breakers in situations where I might want to approach people for a more formal photograph rather than street shooting.

    Good light, Eva (but you have that, you live in Italy!),


  226. Mike…
    That story about Old Man Johnson could happily sit at the beginning of any classic 20th century novel. Or the whole theme for a story…

  227. Burnians any photography books you loved to buy but are just overpriced?
    Mine would have to be Brooklyn Gang – Bruce Davidson and maybe Mala Noche – Antoine D´Agata…

  228. you all are trying to match writers with photographers…interesting…but i can tell you i am only sorry Hunter S. is gone…need him now, even though wrong continent for him but he coulda adjusted….for my upcoming RIO….any second choices on this one ? hmmm..cannot think of any….

  229. In this age David you need a international orientated writer not a American centric provincial writer like Hunter S ……….

  230. a civilian-mass audience

    oups…who said the mice can play…the cat is never away…:)))

    MIKER…damnit you and your stories…Gravy JIM and Old Man Johnson…
    yeap,I will second PAUL …and third and fourth…
    and yes…EVA has the best light…Viva Italy!
    you are all in the wrong place…
    come over in the land of the Free and the desperate…oime…
    No permission needed:)

  231. a civilian-mass audience

    IMANTS…yeap…with HUNTER…
    we will all be Cursed…the Curse of Lono…hmmm…
    someone has to reconsider…:)))

  232. a civilian-mass audience

    MARCCCCCCCCC…I was looking for you…

    Thanks for coming back…we missed you!

  233. Place any writer worth his/her salt in any situation, he/she can produce. No sweat. So HST in Rio with Harvey? Yeah, that would work!

    Paul… That’s a tough one. But yes, I could picture Davidson and Richards in that case. Perhaps Dennis Stock?

  234. civi…still here but photo stuff has taken a back seat.

    been a tough few months. my wife sylvia, passed away in october and life as a widower with 2 young daughters has been an adjustment to say the least.

    haven’t been able to photograph yet but started making sculptures with existing photos of sylvia, which has been healing.

  235. Ok, Civi, let me rectify: would you all please STOP to talk about picture and photo books???

    Thanks, much appreciated.. ;)

    Marc, thanks for that link, great!

  236. Civil liberties are being eroded because governments in affluent countries like ours know that acquiring wealth and feeding a family are more important issues to the population. They also know that the constituents are quite content to sit on the fence when it comes to their civil liberties.
    Most of us do nothing……. we are not members of a political party, therefore leaving our voice and the decision making to the few that are involved at a party level. Twenty years ago my local party branch had 700 odd active members now there are less than 30, despite the party being the current one in government. Few have joined another party as I have, most are old members and even fewer bother to turn up.
    We may occasionally join a half hearted protest march, we write stuff on the net complain and never act upon it. We leave it to the old hardened campaigners and the wide eyed bushy tailed young to do our protesting for us.

  237. a civilian-mass audience


    come over in Grecolandia…I make wine…you make sculptures…
    But you have to feed the chickens…
    otherwise I am gonna tell Sylvia…I have lots of friends up there…

    Well…the circle of life…be strong…we are here…!

  238. Imants…
    And sadly to many the Sunday football match is of much more vital issue than “boring” concepts like civil liberties.

  239. a civilian-mass audience

    EVA…can I call you the moving Bookstore…
    (to be perceived as a compliment)

    IMANTS…you really can write…BRAVOIMANTS!!!

  240. Michael Kircher…

    I am not up on Dennis Stock I know a little of his work and of course the classic James Dean image. I´ve always thought he was one of those kind of underrated photographers. But you´ve picked my curiosity so I am going to search out a little more!

  241. a civilian-mass audience


    REF:your question

    I will go with LARRY TOWELL…but what do I know…
    I am just a civilian with restricted liberties…

    ok,enough said…Goodnight from beautiful Grecolandia
    the land of the free and the desperate…:)

  242. Civi, you can.. I’ll move around two countries something like.. no, I better not say how many.. books tomorrow on my way home.. and been only to two galleries/exhibits so far, Paolo Pellegrin’s tomorrow..

    In the meantime, Magnum Foundation has a new website (new to me at least):


    BUT they got the EPF wrong, it’s RICHER!!

  243. Civil Liberties is a subject on sites like this one and people seem to feel strongly about it…….. unfortunately few go beyond and take up the issues in real life. Taking photos under the guise of “journalism” of infringements of civil liberties is no longer enough, one has to enact upon on a local level. The wwwdot world is full of stuff but few bother with it.

  244. Imants…
    Here in Spain most people I know are totally disenchanted with politicians in general. They have stop believing in them and it is with both right and left wing.

  245. But they vote for them and don’t change aspects on the domestic and party floor level. Basically they got what they deserved by failing to be involved with the running of their country, leaving those difficult decisions to others.

  246. Day to day civil liberties/rights are very much a non issues in affluent western countries on sites like facebook. Sure there are howls and wails about Egypt, Congo, Libya etc but the home everyday living front is about what’s in it for me. That’s the way we as affluent societies evidently must like it

  247. And I know it sounds amazing but the majority I know personally work/friendships are admitting they have no intention of even turning up to vote. Funny considering they lived 40 years under dictatorship…

  248. Maybe they need to work harder, take less, be involved and get their country back on its feet so the the less fortunate also get something

  249. Talking about Libya I found it interesting that in a Spanish national paper 55% of those asked were in favour of the USA taking military action in the crisis. USA regularly gets criticized for the way it handles most international affairs especially military wise. However when the shit hits the fan we always turn to the same country to make the big tough ugly sacrifices.

  250. The whole concept of working hard is seen as making a quick buck instead of working hard just to establish a solid businesses for future generations. Its all a concept of now, right now. This only causes a very false economy where the younger generations believe money lent by banks is actual personal wealth.

  251. Banks will be run by the young people soon and the will want their money and won’t lend indiscriminately to other young people

  252. But of course I suspect this is the perfect scenario for any goverment…population all up to their eyes in mortgages, tied down to a job just to pay that 30 year dream. No free time to stop, civil liberties being eroded and just in case on the weekends these families do find time we will have them occupied with football and reality shows.

  253. They are a smart lot that younger generation what concerns me is the baby boomer set who feel that they have a right to everything that is good and others should bow to their needs

  254. and the middle class is starting to slowly dissapear and we may end up with just the very poor and the very rich. But the middle class is needed to make the economy spin in any country, they are the real consumers.

  255. and now it’s time to hand over tonight’s late night show to the one only and sometimes angry but always free Panos. :))

  256. Imants; Funny you mentioned banks… A good friend of mine (a farmer) was talking to his bank manager yesterday and was told that their bank was already back to lending (on farms etc) as before the crash. They just ensure their potential losses are covered by the vast majority of “safe” loans (in the current interest rates).

    So in other words; Mr Joe Average the careful spender/borrower subsidises the a-holes….

  257. The poor are the real consumers as they spend on a day to day basis, those bargain shops, food markets etc keep the economies turning over at a steady rate.

    Western governments spend a lot time and energy on retirement issues as that is where the votes are and most politicians are superannuation/retirement benefits conscious. Make voting compulsory (another civil liberty gone) and the the issues shift to other sectors of the comminity


    Hells Angels
    See also: Hell’s Angels: The Strange and Terrible Saga of the Outlaw Motorcycle Gangs
    In 1965, Carey McWilliams, editor of The Nation, offered Thompson the opportunity to write a story based on his experience with the California-based Hells Angels motorcycle club. After The Nation published the article (May 17, 1965), Thompson received several book offers and spent the next year living and riding with the Hell’s Angels. The relationship broke down when the bikers concluded that Thompson was exploiting them for his personal gain. The gang demanded a share of the profits from his writings and after an argument at a party Thompson ended up with a savage beating, or “stomping” as the Angels referred to it…
    savage beating
    savage beating
    savage beating

  259. Civi:

    “I can’t stand cold( FROSTFROG VIVA)…as I said here before…I always follow the sun…”

    I LOVE the cold – but I hate being cold, if that makes any sense.

    But sometimes, I really want to stand in the sun on a warm beach somewhere, where the water is warm and the ladies don’t wear much, if anything at all.

  260. GONZO- HUNTER S. T.

    Birth of Gonzo
    Main article: Gonzo journalism
    Also in 1970, Thompson wrote an article entitled The Kentucky Derby Is Decadent and Depraved for the short-lived new journalism magazine Scanlan’s Monthly. Although it was not widely read at the time, the article is the first of Thompson’s to use techniques of Gonzo journalism, a style he would later employ in almost every literary endeavor. The manic first-person subjectivity of the story was reportedly the result of sheer desperation; he was facing a looming deadline and started sending the magazine pages ripped out of his notebook. Ralph Steadman, who would later collaborate with Thompson on several projects, contributed expressionist pen-and-ink illustrations.
    The first use of the word Gonzo to describe Thompson’s work is credited to the journalist Bill Cardoso. Cardoso had first met Thompson on a bus full of journalists covering the 1968 New Hampshire primary. In 1970, Cardoso (who, by this time had become the editor of The Boston Globe Sunday Magazine) wrote to Thompson praising the “Kentucky Derby” piece in Scanlan’s Monthly as a breakthrough: “This is it, this is pure Gonzo. If this is a start, keep rolling.” Thompson took to the word right away, and according to illustrator Ralph Steadman said,:

    “Okay, that’s what I do. Gonzo.”

    Thompson’s first published use of the word Gonzo appears in a passage in Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas: A Savage Journey to the Heart of the American Dream: “Free Enterprise. The American Dream. Horatio Alger gone mad on drugs in Las Vegas. Do it now: pure Gonzo journalism.”

  261. i RECEIVED this email this morning:

    “Dear Friends,

    Due to an unexpected scheduling conflict, the exhibition “Provocation” will now open on Saturday, March 26.

    Artists selected for participation in the show will be notified by Wednesday, March 9 and all work will need to be dropped off at the powerHouse Arena no later than Friday, March 25.

    We are really sorry for any inconvenience this may cause!

    the NYPH team”

  262. Death

    Thompson died at his self-described “fortified compound” known as “Owl Farm” in Woody Creek, Colorado, at 5:42 p.m. on February 20, 2005, from a self-inflicted gunshot wound to the head.
    Thompson’s son (Juan), daughter-in-law (Jennifer Winkel Thompson) and grandson (Will Thompson) were visiting for the weekend at the time of his suicide. Will and Jennifer were in the adjacent room when they heard the gunshot. Mistaking the shot for the sound of a book falling, they continued with their activities for a few minutes before checking on him. The police report concerning his death stated that in a typewriter in front of Thompson, they found “a piece of paper carrying the date ‘Feb 22 ’05’ and the single word ‘counselor’.”
    They reported to the press that they do not believe his suicide was out of desperation, but was a well-thought out act resulting from Thompson’s many painful and chronic medical conditions. Thompson’s wife, Anita, who was at a gym at the time of her husband’s death, was on the phone with him when he ended his life.
    What family and police describe

    as a suicide note

    was written by Thompson four days before his death, and left for his wife. It was later published by Rolling Stone. Titled “Football Season Is Over”,
    it read:

    “No More Games. No More Bombs. No More Walking. No More Fun. No More Swimming. 67. That is 17 years past 50. 17 more than I needed or wanted. Boring. I am always bitchy. No Fun — for anybody. 67. You are getting Greedy. Act your old age. Relax — This won’t hurt.”

  263. Marc – I have to agree with you there. It was the “hate” part I said “yes..” to.

    Only those who do it get it, and not even them, really, for if they truly got it, they wouldn’t do it.

  264. Rio and literary inspiration? How about Jerzy Kosinski, especially “The Hermit of 69th Street”:

    “Persons attempting to find a motive in this narrative will be prosecuted; persons attempting to find a moral in it will be banished; persons attempting to find a plot in it will be shot.” – Mark Twain, as quoted in above.

    His “Passion Play” or “Being There” would work too.

  265. “Journalism is not a profession or a trade. It is a cheap catch-all for fuckoffs and misfits–a false doorway to the backside of life, a filthy piss-ridden little hole nailed off by the building inspector, but just deep enough for a wino to curl up from the sidewalk and masturbate like a chimp in a zoo-cage.” HST


  266. a civilian-mass audience

    I shoot freestyle too…foxes and weasels…sexy?hmmm…

    come south…don’t forget the cat you have promised and bring some of the high blood pressure pills…
    you never know when a strike will hit in Grecolandia…you always have to be prepared…


    We are “cursed” now…we are BURNIANS!!!

  267. Yes it´s FRIDAY!!!!!

    I love Fridays I´m sure it´s got something to do with…

    “If you must have motivation, think of your paycheck on Friday.”
    Noel Coward

    “Youth is like a long weekend on Friday night. Middle age is like a long weekend on Monday afternoon.” Richard Nelson Bolles

    “Only Robinson Crusoe had everything done by Friday.”

    “Weekends don’t count unless you spend them doing something completely pointless.” Bill Watterson

    “There aren’t enough days in the weekend.” Rod Schmidt

    “A weekend wasted isn’t a wasted weekend.”

    “Middle age is when you’re sitting at home on a Saturday night and the telephone rings and you hope it isn’t for you.” Ogden Nash

    “Living up to ideals is like doing everyday work with your Sunday clothes on.” Ed Howe

  268. a civilian-mass audience

    “Born on Monday, Fair in face; Born on Tuesday, Full of God’s grace; Born on Wednesday, Sour and sad; Born on Thursday, Merry and glad; Born on Friday, Worthily given; Born on Saturday, Work hard for your living; Born on Sunday, You will never know wa”

    hmmm…don’t think so…:)))

  269. OK we now know David would love to have Hunter S with him on his trip to Rio. However who would be the perfect writer to accompany David on his American Family essay?
    Do we choose the obvious suspects…?
    James Agee, John Steinbeck…
    Or someone else?

  270. “Middle age is when you’re sitting at home on a Saturday night and the telephone rings and you hope it isn’t for you.” Ogden Nash

    I was born middle age then!

  271. Frostfrog/Panos
    Our big brown tabby is back from the pet hospital with a $1500 plus bill. May have to postpone the Fuji X100 purchase.

    ‘Hate it, get it’
    While I do love my life, and hate it when someone commits suicide, I do get it too. Release.

  272. Gordon…
    Yes kids and animals always come first in life…ALWAYS.
    Without us they are defenceless…

    A happy arrangement: many people prefer cats to other people, and many cats prefer people to other cats.
    Mason Cooley

    As anyone who has ever been around a cat for any length of time well knows, cats have enormous patience with the limitations of the human kind.
    Cleveland Amory

    Cats know how to obtain food without labor, shelter without confinement, and love without penalties.
    W. L. George

  273. Question…
    Can i develop Tri-x in D76 if I have rated it at 800iso? If so, 20% extra time in the developer enough? I’ve also got HC110…

  274. Mike R
    Thanks, i didn’t go there as I tried a couple of months ago shooting T-max 400 also at 800 and it looked awful. Anyway T-max has little in common with Tri-x so I will start at your link.
    Hmmm i’ve also got Hp5 in my bag!

  275. Paul. the question is..what is your intent in doing a one stop push?
    do you need it because of lighting?
    did you set the camera/meter wrong?
    are you just push curious?
    I mean, a one stop push will hardly affect the tonality of tri x at all. A one stop pull would do more.
    How you develop it, and what you develop it in, are more likely to give you tonal/grain variations.
    d76 is good for tri x 1:1 standard agitation for that ‘classic’ PJ look.
    HP5 also looks great in D76 1:1 (my current ‘standard’ film/dev combo)

  276. Paul, John G is the b&w Master around here.

    Gordon, hope Apollo gets well soon. As you say, a handsome greek boy – what’s not to love!

    I am owned by two cats and I have to go for a walk every evening with them (really, it’s a cat thing). One evening I was stood on the corner with them, looking like a burglar, when I heard a neighbour calling his cat. He had let his young son (who was a fan of King Arthur and the knights of the Round Table) name the cat. There he was, shouting Lancelot! Lancelot! At least it wasn’t Guinevere.

    I am reliably informed that some of my neighbours call me the Cat Whisperer – amongst other things (laughing).


  277. Paul.. Kodak doesn’t differntiate between 400 and 800, times are the same.. I do not agree with them, at 800 i do 12 minutes (or 12.30, depending on exposure, light situation, what you want to achieve), instead of 9.45, that’s D-76 1+1 (not full strenght), at 20°C…

  278. Those who can, go and see Paolo Pellegrin’s exhibition ‘DIES IRAE’, until May, 15th in Milan, but I’m sure it will be shown elsewhere too..

    I don’t know how a photographer can go back and back and back again to take the pictures he does.. I am sure he will, or is already, paying a toll.. insane what we human beings do to one another, as if what nature does wouldn’t be enough…


  279. a civilian-mass audience

    Apollonas…was god of the sun,poetry,arts,prophesy…and a god of healing…
    he was the most handsome…like your Apollo
    may the spirits of health be with him…tell him…I am sending Greek energy …he will feel it…
    he is Greek afterall…!

    “A cat has absolute emotional honesty: human beings, for one reason or another, may hide their feelings, but a cat does not.”
    Ernest Hemingway
    I wonder what Simone is doing…?

    BURN is the place to be…we even have a Cat Whisperer…oime…:))))))))
    What not to lOVE!

  280. a civilian-mass audience

    Is this PAOLO, our BURNING boy…
    the one that we are waiting to drink wine and check his pictures…hmmm..
    EVA…you are everywhere…BRAVOEVA!!!

  281. John…
    I am doing it for three reasons two of which you’ve pointed out….
    Yes lighting…also push curious haven’t done it since college. And finally and perhaps in some ways the most important reason… i have always had problems with the 35mm aesthetic. I must admit for many years I have had a strong disdain for that 35mm grainy look. Probably too many years making 8×10 contact prints. So i want to get rid of that stupidity, so I am going to jump in the deep end, I am convinced i will grow to love and feel at ease with it.
    When you refer to pull i assume you mean just extending developing time without altering the iso.
    Is Jacob Sobol’s Sabine pushed or pulled because I wouldn’t mind achieving that ‘look’.

  282. Thanks Eva…
    A friend of mine shot two rolls at an ilegal boxing match over here. He followed Kodak times and so did I with something less important. It all turned out crap…

  283. Eva

    Would you email me? I have no idea how to contact you…

    I am at: erica [at] ericamcdonaldphoto [dot] com


  284. 8 hours solid, outdoors in sideways rain and gale-force today…
    blistering rain which the wind chill turned to sharp ice on occasion…
    the best thor could provide…
    leaning into the wind with eyes pressed tight and a screaming laugh emanating..
    life does not get better.

    took 0 photos

  285. then a warm sun.. orange as it is..

    every day now the light is lasting 5 mins longer..

    hardly done any photo work the past couple of weeks as life has taken over.



  286. picking up my camera tomorrow..
    then an evening of scanning, which life has become of late.

    utterly invigorated, if utterly exhausted.

    changes are afoot…

    harvey – hunter T was a lightweight..
    the man who raised-the-bar became the base for some kind of reality.
    i know some excellent european writers who can hold-their-own.. twist and expand.. extrapolate and conclude.. and do it all “altered”..


  287. DAH-

    Still looking for a digi assistant? My Brazil visa is fresh, valid and just lightly used. My Portuguese is horrendous, but I’ve got a place to stay in Lagoa and a flexible schedule.

  288. a civilian-mass audience

    Come on PANOS…you speak Portuguese too…
    you might be young BUT as a kid I bet you have learned the basics…:

    Pele,Ronaldo,Garrincha,Ronaldino,Leonidas de Silva,Kaka,Cafu,Roberto,Rivaldo…Socrates,Oscar,


  289. CIVI.. yes, that’s the same Paolo.. wouldn’t be surprised if he was in Lybia now..

    PAUL.. pushing to 800 is not really it, it’s tame.. and when you see Pellegrin’s prints on the wall, I assure you, you won’t be distracted by anything.. impressive work..

    PANOS, my pleasure, shhhhhhhhhhhh.. ;)

    ERICA.. email sent..

  290. a civilian-mass audience

    I have a question…”Monkey do” aisle…by MICHELLE…

    Do I see painted nails…or no? cause it reminds me of someone…hmmm…
    from the book of face area…I scratch my …head…I squeeze my leftover brain cells…

  291. a civilian-mass audience

    yeap…you see…you speak Portuguese…

    goodnight and goodmorning My BURNIANS!!!

  292. and the BEST song of all Times:

    “There must be some way out of here” said the joker to the thief
    “There’s too much confusion”, I can’t get no relief
    Businessmen, they drink my wine, plowmen dig my earth
    None of them along the line know what any of it is worth.

    “No reason to get excited”, the thief he kindly spoke
    “There are many here among us who feel that life is but a joke

    But you and I, we’ve been through that, and this is not our fate
    So let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late”.

    All along the watchtower, princes kept the view
    While all the women came and went, barefoot servants, too.

    Outside in the distance a wildcat did growl
    Two riders were approaching, the wind began to howl.

  293. hey ALL

    BURN is now iPhone/iPad compatible… enjoy

    you might need to refresh/empty your cache on your mobile device to see it working

    Still ironing out many glitches, and manually retroactively updating every single essay that has ever been published here on BURN… but we’re getting there…

    The red fullscreen button got lost in the process, but working hard to bring it back!!

    patience, and we’ll get there….

    hugs to all…


  294. ANTON!!

    Argh.. you just destroyed one of my two reasons for not buying an iPad.. thank you ;)

  295. Panos…

    Even Bob Dylan said he preferred Hendrix´s version!
    Here is Hendrix playing another Bob Dylan classic…

  296. Anton…

    The update seems only compatible with iPhone and iPad.
    But no worries, still best place round the world!!

  297. ANTON….HAIK

    many many thanks for helping to make Burn iPad compatible…you guys both put so much work into Burn…a deep deep bow of appreciation from me amigos…..

    i think i will buy version 2 coming up…pictures do look so totally translucent and something like an 8×10 transparency sitting on a light table…just amazing…this does not take away my love of print, but will i think totally change books as we know them…not eliminate paper books…but if you can buy an iPad book for say $5. it will exponentially increase the potential audience for a book…i will defintily build a RIO iPad book with sound , music, video and a portfolio as per usual of simply from the gut imagery as well as a magazine style slick paper book..Rio lends itself to this sort of presentation, so we will see how it goes…

    Anton on design? right? smiling….

    ok, gotta run…as usual no sleep, but this time around i am shooting mostly the edges …not the main action….rich immersion…the stuff i write about on Burn and teach all the time…but right now smack in the middle of my element…this is it….just the best…rolling rolling….

    cheers, david

  298. a civilian-mass audience

    MY apologies…but I was wrong when I posted this…

    CAUSE…Everyday should be a BURN APPRECIATION DAY…

  299. a civilian-mass audience

    oups …This…
    a civilian-mass audience
    March 1, 2011 at 5:02 pm
    Today…1st of MARCH …I was thinking to make it…( a suggestion)
    I need more names…my memory is getting weak…but all of you(u know your names)…behind the tent…
    “We tend to forget that happiness doesn’t come as a result of getting something we don’t have, but rather of recognizing and appreciating what we do have.”
    you may not have a Leica M9 or M10…or a trendy lens…
    you may not have THE “pics” of the year
    you may not won any awards…
    you have…( I am not gonna make it easy for you)
    each one of you…I repeat,YOU HAVE what you have that you know that you Have…
    P.S Now,we have to figure out …the Appreciation day for MR.DAVID ALAN HARVEY…

  300. a civilian-mass audience


    March 5, 2011 at 5:06 am
    hey ALL
    BURN is now iPhone/iPad compatible… enjoy
    you might need to refresh/empty your cache on your mobile device to see it working
    Still ironing out many glitches, and manually retroactively updating every single essay that has ever been published here on BURN… but we’re getting there…
    The red fullscreen button got lost in the process, but working hard to bring it back!!
    patience, and we’ll get there….
    hugs to all…

  301. a civilian-mass audience

    EVOLUTION…REVOLUTION…come on …the Universe is really working…

    ANTON…HAIK…all of you…Thank you from my civilian heart…
    “…Still ironing out many glitches, and MANUALLY retroactively updating every single essay that has ever been published here on BURN… but we’re getting there…”

    oime…manually every single essay…
    damnit…damnit to the Greek goverment and to all the goverments out there who play games…
    and brought civilians …down to the last cent…
    But the revolution will come…and then I will donate not 5euros BUT the whole nine yards…as you English
    people say…

    VIVA…thank you…What not to dam LOVE !!!:)))

  302. a civilian-mass audience

    By the way…

    mark this day…cause today…we have “history”…

    MR.HARVEY …thank you.

  303. I ordered on Thursday night Sergei Pinkhassov´s Sightwalk which David recommended. As I didn´t really know what I had bought I was a little curious to see what the book was about. So I googled his name this afternoon and I found this interesting and probably rare discussion on of all places Photonet!!


    Thought I should share it as usual. I have not finished reading the discussion I have only skimmed over it as I am off with two 35mm cameras a load of slide film and a couple of rolls of Hp5 to shoot the local carnival!

  304. PAUL

    one of the most interesting aspects of Sightwalk is how it came about..came from fear of leaving the hotel…Pinkhassov freaked by the enormity of Tokyo….unable to leave his hotel….did not leave his hotel…shot the 25 pictures that are Sightwalk from his hotel…lobby, from his room window etc

  305. Fascinating about Pinkhassov (whose photos I admire) and his inability to leave the hotel in a large and yet very benign city (Tokyo is not, say, Johannesburg) and yet becoming a Magnum photographer. There’s hope for us all! Will have to check out Sightwalk….

  306. Pinkhassov is one of my, bar none, favorite of the older Magnum photographers…funny story: he is the one (after HCB) who educated me about Magnum…knew nothing about Magnum, didn’t care at all, when i first started shooting ‘seriously’, or believing that photography would replace my desire for painting/making movies….and i discovered the year i began, 1999….i’d always been defined and inspired by Tarkovsky, and one weekend, i stumbled upon Sightwalk….it reminded me so much of poetry, zen…and then when i found out he’d worked with tarkovsky when younger, i was hooked….for me Sightwalk is one of the great late 20th century photobooks….i put it next to Goodbye PHotography, Ravens, Eggleston’s guide, Americans, Giacomelli’s oevre and Unfinished Disertation as one of the most important photobooks in my life…i’ve owned and given away 4 copies of the book…

    more like a great film by my hero Chris Marker, than a photobook….Sightwalk remains like an electric cut to my head and heart, forever…

  307. David…
    I can’t wait for Pinkhassov’s book to arrive! The whole concept of not leaving the hotel is fascinating and actually marvelous considering I’m on crutches and having huge problems trying to express myself with my camera.

  308. Having the time of my life!! It sure ain’t Rio but it’s a carnival. Laughing I sure miss my M6 this 1dsII sticks out like a sore thumb! :))))

  309. a civilian-mass audience

    carnival in my place too…Carnival everywhere…yeap,not like Rio…:)

    and don’t expect any photos…I carry only the essentials…a stick and a bottle:)))

  310. a civilian-mass audience

    MR.PINKHASSOV if you hear me…

    come over…”we will be treat you right”…Viva!!!

  311. a civilian-mass audience

    “we will be treated right…or we will treat you right”

    I will be back…when the sun comes out

  312. Speechless

    My iPhone agreed with anything Anton said above…
    No question asked:)
    History indeed… Now I can watch the whole essay while stuck on PCH traffic… Priceless:)

  313. & JESUS,
    I hope u remember me when you become a king..!
    (and I hope I’ll visit the bathroom at the “usual” time coz I consumed lots of protein last night…:)
    biggest hug y’all

  314. CHARLES

    well i am sure you know that becoming a Magnum photographer has nothing to do with becoming/or not becoming a “professional” photographer…you just have to be a photographer…period

  315. Paul :))

    THANKS…it is done….i’m now writing the text…and actually adding new pictures (what is new)…i promised to send David it by end of March…i changed the entire thing after being in russia and beginning work on the 3rd chapter of my Russian work….and of course, just came together now, as i’ve been reading Moby-dick…..it all makes sense….

    unlike ‘bones of time’ or ‘oxen of the sun’, i don;’t want to rush this…i want it out there when i feel good…everything i’ve published before over the last 5 years, i usually shoot quick, with limited about of film, preserving my ‘best’ work for the book i’ve been at work on for a while…a kind of waiting…these published things always like exercises to see what i think the book should take….but this essay (‘loomings’) is different….i want it to blow away the readership…and it will upset some, as there are alot of prose-photographs….so, just waiting…the eye thing had a profound effect as did Melville, it made me change the entire thing…

    as for the eye: i feel good, happy, no pain….have accepted the inevitable (it will be lost) but until that day, living in the moment and working my ass off for my family and my writing/pictures…


  316. a civilian-mass audience


    yeap,we have lived in the kibbutz,in the BURN hotel with open windows…we traveled with the
    beaten up caravan,the BURNing bus …when BURNIANS were flying off the roof…
    we slept in the tent…roadtrips oime…and we keep rolling…and when MR.HARVEY plays his harmonica…
    you my photophilosophers and my silent MASS Audience…we dance and sing like the fauns and the bacchantes
    of Dionysos…oime!!!

    P.S BOBBY…I am waiting for “loomings”…and since I don’t believe in the “inevitable”…
    everyday is a new beginning…but you are HOMER…you already know…!!!

  317. panos.. new york was fun..
    next time we need courvosiers man-who-can ..
    more mess ..
    we need to bring on “the quickening” and raise the dead..
    journey to the end of the night..

    civilian.. Vær så god! du tar magien, vil jeg bringe øl

  318. “one of the most interesting aspects of Sightwalk is how it came about..came from fear of leaving the hotel…Pinkhassov freaked by the enormity of Tokyo….unable to leave his hotel….did not leave his hotel…shot the 25 pictures that are Sightwalk from his hotel…lobby, from his room window etc”

    I find that the camera is often an excuse to experience different places/people that I normally would feel were too far out of my comfort zone. It’s as though you “hide” behind the camera and take on a new persona…

  319. a civilian-mass audience

    hmmm…I feel kinda the same when I put on my reading glasses,hold tight my bottle and log in …
    as a civilian-mass…the problem is when I logg off…I am still the same…:))) or so I think…:)))

    DAVIDB….you speak Norvegian…like VIVEK…hmmm…where is VIVEK,LASSAL,MY KATIEEEEEEEEEE…,LEE
    AUDREY…JIMMY…KATHARINA…and…and…CHARLES…enjoy the Hawaian waves…

    LOVE to ALLL…u have to check the leg(WENDY is right)…workshop extented…oime…!!!

  320. a civilian-mass audience

    ohh…and before I go…to feed the chickens…
    don’t forget that ou BURN CREW…the people behind of the tent…
    They are All Photographers…emerging icons…

    damnit…we are kicking asses…as MICHAELK would say…!

    I will be back…

  321. Oh i’m quite the opposite my character/personality lets me get away with murder. I have no problems getting in close with people. So i have the opposite problem… once i lift the camera to my eye I feel the most defenceless insecure human being on earth. Photography for me has a lot to do with taming doubt.

  322. All..
    Ask yourself how much time you allot each week to fun… pure, unadulterated, nonproductive fun?
    STOP assidously avoiding fun.
    Fun leads to creativity. It leads to rebellion and makes you feel powerful and alive.

  323. I suspect he was refering to those who just go through the motions of life. But don’t really participate. A bit like the civil liberties topic everyone voices an opinion but few actually take steps to prevent it’s errosion.

  324. a civilian-mass audience

    hmmm…yes,this is a strong statement from Socrates…
    we have to examine our past…to stop doing the same mistakes over and over and to find our real purpose
    in life…of course between work ,kids,workshops,chickens,families,weird bosses…we have no time
    for inner examination…
    that’s what Socrates was talking about…the dialogue with ourselves…IMO…

    Ok…time for fun…we can examine later…PARTYYYYYYYYYYY!!!

  325. a civilian-mass audience

    workshop plus,extented,prolonged…
    spread out…unfolded…
    and the PARTY goes on…
    Circle of Life, Circle of friends…
    as long as we BURN…
    we have it All!

  326. a civilian-mass audience

    “… Saving the hot sexy totally outrageous ones for later. Make sense? Stay tuned.

    No comment…I can wait:)))

  327. DAH,

    Yes, of course I know that. Being somewhat cheeky (with tongue). I will be ordering Sightwalk and looking forward to it hopefully inspiring me. But there does seem a spirit to Magnum that includes getting oneself out the door…:)

    But I know that feeling of not wanting to leave the hotel (and just getting in a cab and going back to the airport and home). Exhausted from the flight, not knowing the language, everyone seemingly having a purpose except for you (except to make some “interesting” photos), etc, etc. Can be overwhelming…..

    Anyway, one of the better pieces of advice a friend has given me (it was given to him by his father) was that when one doesn’t know where to start, just start anywhere, and that is most often just where you are at, in the present moment. So I guess in Mr Pinkhassov’s case it was the hotel room. Great stuff….

  328. DAH,

    expectations for your new photos at this time will be very high:))… always been… Cheers

  329. Charles Petersen…
    You really have a brilliant website bursting to the seams with amazing images!

    If the demand to be original still troubles you, remember this: each of us is our own country, an interesting place to visit. It is the accurate mapping out of our own creative interests that invites the term ORIGINAL. We are the origin of our art, its homeland. Viewed this way, originality is the process of remaining true to ourselves.

    Be willing to paint or write badly while your ego yelps resistance. Your writing may be the syntactical breakdown necessary for a shift in your style. Your lousy painting may be pointing you in a new direction. Art needs time to incubate, to sprawl a little, to be ungainly and misshapen and finally emerge as itself. The ego hates this fact. The ego wants instant gratification and the addictive hit of an acknowledge win.</b

    “The Artist´s Way.” Julia Cameron.

  330. ps, that photo.net discussion is filled with gems :), like this nugget:

    “Among photographers I know, living and dead, Pinkhassov’s stuff is the least freighted with a political agenda or social critique (something else he has in common with Ashbery). This stands in contrast of course with the work of many notable others, whether it be, to name three, Steve McCurry’s vapid vision and witless pandering, Sabastiao Salgado’s running stigmata, or Martin Parr’s relentless compulsion to make the obvious obvious. (Though I do appreciate much of the latter’s work, the point wears a bit thin.)”


  331. a civilian-mass audience

    Goodmorning my BURNIANS…

    I was checking MR.HARVEY in the face of book area…best photos…he looks amazing in tuxedo…
    and the ladies are BURNING…
    ok,time for coffee…and check my chickens…
    I will be back!

  332. a civilian-mass audience

    tears in my eyes…and you know me…I don’t cry often BUT there is a BURNING kid in the other aisle…
    A kid from broken Grecolandia…oime…
    I told you the Universe is working…
    keep rolling my BURNIANS,keep shooting…if a Greek kid can do it…you Can All do it…

    MR.HARVEY …speechless…thank you…
    damnit …it’s morning but I have to say VIVAAAAAAAAAAA!!!

  333. a civilian-mass audience


    two chickens gone…oime…
    I am going out…weasles and foxes…here I come…

    but I’ll be back…

  334. i’ve never suffered from equipmentitis, however – scanning the ads in norway i saw this last night – the advert had been up for one hour..

    “leica camera – uses film. think it’s from the 30’s or 40’s.”
    that’s all it said, so i looked up the serial number and lens from the photos, which showed it as an M3 DS – http://bophoto.co.uk/leica%20m3.htm

    it’s a 1957 body with the fast f1.5 bayonet-fit summarit 5cm lens – hotshoe meter, leather case.. actually a complete kit, all clean, clear and working smooth.
    lens has original leitz filter protecting it from new and from the sounds of it has never even been taken off the body.

    absolutely no way of affording it, despite it being only £450 complete..
    i gave them a call anyway.. beate acted as interpreter & they got on like a house on fire.. bea just “gets-on” with people.

    was an elderly gent who inherited it from his late grandfather many years ago..
    it’s hardly been used – seems his grandfather passed soon after buying it new and the seller has never used it – may need a CLA..
    he assured us it has been in his wardrobe, nice and dry, and that everything functions.. lens is as new.

    thought, “bugger.. no money..”

    astonishingly, the guy took a £100 deposit – the rest when i have it..
    … he’s actually sending it today on the strength of the deposit alone ..
    gotta love people.. gotta love beates warm nature.

    the most charming thing about it?
    at the end of the call, when beate told him i’d love to use it, his reply was:

    “you do know it’s not digital?”

  335. David Bowen, you have been charmed…embrace the synchronicity!

    The M3 is by far the sexiest of cameras; its near silent shutter and .90 viewfinder will make you swoon. Best of luck.

  336. eva – so true.. although i’d love to have some money to be more confident in that notion :o)

    jeff – i used them briefly many years ago .. lovely.. just utterly dulled with digital right now and realized my shooting and editing has changed in a way i am not comfortable with.

    with film, (and a lack of money), shooting choices were far more distinct and focused.. aperture.. shutter.. framing.. much more careful.. better considered..
    with digital i tend to shoot more options, which develops into a nightmare editing.. taking much too long.. much less focused shooting. i still get the results i want, yet rather than shooting a maximum of 4 or 5 frames of a scene, i am shooting sometimes twice that.

    along with the speed of digital processing (which i do not need for my current subject as it’s not for clients) also comes much less thinking time and evolution.. less waiting..

    wholeheartedly looking forward to some rangefinder discipline again :o)

  337. I agree, David. It seems I use film 90% of the time for about 70% of my images. Something not talked about with regard to the resurgence of film is the delayed gratification we get waiting for the film to be developed. It was something all of us old enough to remember the film-only days can relate to; rolls would wait for months sometimes to be viewed. Inevitably there would be a few gems that were totally forgotten about and thus doubly treasured. The approach helps focus one’s objectivity toward the images as well; one of the reasons Winogrand wouldn’t develop his work for years at a time.

    If you need a PC adapter for flash work with the M3, B&H Cameras has them in stock.

  338. a civilian-mass audience

    Film, cameras,hiii…”I never suffered from equipmentitis…”…awesome…!

    What not to love…internet on off…oime…snowing in grecolandia…
    I haven’t seen snow outside my window since 1987…

    What not to Love…My BURNIANS…ouzo and wine and gigantes and kalamaria and xtapodia on me
    today we celebrate…!

    in case I loose connection…remember this…You ALL are Unique and talented…
    I love you ALLLLL…let it snow…my spirits,let it snow!

  339. :o)
    apparently i have to shove a meter long strip of animal-fat coated, silver crystal infused plastic in one end and ‘bobs yer uncle’, slices of time come out the other end.

    it’ll never catch on.

  340. a civilian-mass audience

    DB…tell BEATE…she rocks:)
    can she negotiate with the local wine dealer:)
    come on now, I am your civilian…no pictures from my side…
    I am waiting DIMAS,TOR CAPA,FELIX…new blood …in the horizon!
    wi-fi …I am in?!

  341. a civilian-mass audience

    ok,back to my aisle…

    we are all in big family afterall…
    again my email is civilianma@yahoo.com…in case anyone else wants some help…to cross over!

    Rock on…pouf all clear…I think!!!

  342. DB, enjoy the Leica! It’s amazing how similar it is to my MP.

    Since I’ve bought the MP the 5d 2 has sat idle. I’m going to sell it and put the money towards another M lens.


  343. a civilian-mass audience

    snowing …where is my spring…
    did I see carnival…
    I better stop the ouzo and the kalamaria…right now…!!!

    I will be back…with feta cheese!

  344. a civilian-mass audience

    he was born as a BURNIAN…camera on the face…
    I can wait…to see him BURNING!!!

    EVA…always with the rocking links!

  345. saw a tantalizing taste of CHRIS BICKFORDS next essay .. just briefly then it was gone..
    at a guess having that and “greece in reverse” up at once, once the same day, would have split the attention..

    it’s good .. i like his chosen subject matter :o)
    tomorrow.. tomorrow..

  346. a civilian-mass audience

    EVA…please you have to be in the book of face area…

    you can’t miss THE pic … MR.HARVEY and the BURNING LADIES in RIO…
    What not to LOVE!!!

  347. CIVI.. sorry.. thank you, but no thanks ;))

    I’m sure I’ll get to see the pic sooner or later..

  348. a civilian-mass audience

    Ok, respect…
    maybe a tech person can copy and paste…
    I am the best on this one…BUT I don’t know about FB links…’

    PARTYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY…snow in my window…Grecoland is turning white…

  349. Civi.. you better get them chicken the snowboots out ;)) .. cold here, freezing, but pale sun’s going down..

  350. Speaking of snow; went out to the mailbox yesterday and saw the first snow of the year on the mountain after our first cold weekend. Autumn has grabbed a foothold…

    Can anyone help me with something please? Does anyone know the name of the singer who was supposedly so anti-social that he only had one chair in his house so visitors could never stay? I’ve just had an idea swirling around in the mind about it… Thanks!

    Eva; You remember me mentioning my friends who have the self-sufficient organic farm? I was at their place a few days ago and they asked me if I would like to shoot an essay of their lifestyle/life.

    I had only mentioned it once a few weeks ago; but they must have been thinking about it ever since. The main reason for them is that it will be a record of their family. Also; it’s quite an important time for them, as in another 2-3 years their two kids will have left home and an era will have ended.

  351. “Speaking of snow; went out to the mailbox yesterday and saw the first snow of the year on the mountain after our first cold weekend. Autumn has grabbed a foothold…”

    Ross, if you’re looking for sympathy, you are not likely to get it from the North American contingent here. Trust me on that one.

  352. Lance Rosenfield just shot a video in my apartment in Rio that we (Chris Bickford, Lance, Tony Skater, and I) are trying to decide if this should be a pay per view offering…we laughed and laughed and figured we could easily charge 99cents just to see what would happen…Lance shot a brilliant 4 minute no cuts docu from a goodbye offering to Tony who had to catch a plane tonight…we could sell this thing, but we won’t of course…up soonest one way or another…classic…oh yes we had had a few caipirinhas during the making of this soon to be classic movie…

    we might just for fun pop in a teaser , just to see IF you would pay 99cents…i mean we are trying to get the net going…just playing…stay tuned

    cheers, david

  353. Ross, you’re most welcome to have the snow – As Akaky has alluded to, we have had our fill of the enjoyable mess but, it’s time to share it with our friends to the south.

    David – I’m Intrigued!

  354. No sympathy needed! :-) Where I live we get snow about once every 3-4 years (on the mountain ring-plain). Our last “snowstorm” started at 6am, finished at 10am, and was melted by 11.30am! :-)

  355. David Bowen: PC adapter is here…


    Eva: My friend sent me the “Head On” link Saturday, and it was refreshing to see Gilden in a more introspective mood than I’ve seen in past videos. What was really intriguing was his comment that on the street, “I shoot myself”…and then moments later he comes upon his emotional doppleganger. They ask each other questions, give half-answers, interrupt, and essentially don’t listen to one another at all. Remarkable!

    I’ve often thought what we shoot, and why we shoot it, is somehow autobiographical, at least on a subconscious level. Our need for creativity is a way to bridge the impossibility of understanding ourself. When David tells Vissaria that life seen through a viewfinder is more intense than usual, could it not be, like it is said in “Zen Bow, Zen Arrow”, that what we focus on is ourself – that we become the target?

    “I shoot myself” – what a concept!

  356. a civilian-mass audience

    Goodmorning from white Grecolandia…

    Snow,cold…three baby chickens gone …I couldn’t save them all…
    but at least we have RIO…where is HOT ,HOT,HOT…!!!

  357. a civilian-mass audience

    I WOULD PAY 50cents Euro exchange…yeap…BRING IT ON MR.HARVEY, BRING IT ON…!!!

    oime…I have to find the SKOULIDAS family…
    hmmm…I see the proudest Uncle around…

    Coffee best when is HOT,HOT,HOT…!

  358. we had snow for a couple of days over the weekend..
    now – it’s blowing a gail on our little island in the north sea..
    all boats grounded.. the docks are shut..
    no work, no photos..

  359. a civilian-mass audience

    DAVIDB…scanning?…are u still scanning???…oime…

  360. a civilian-mass audience

    I am coming back from the world of the facebook…
    Lovely stuff…you BURNIANS rock…

    I see HERVE…HERVE come over to this aisle…Your photos AMAZING…!!!

    Rock on MY BURNIANS…rock on!!!

  361. a civilian-mass audience

    and HERVE…don’t forget to bring and some pics…
    cause some BURNIANS…are not in the FB area…!

    ” what of the nut”…oime…I have to google this one…:)

  362. Ross… yes, I remember.. time to become a farmer for a while maybe.. immerse yourself.. great :)
    Oh, did you ever get around to develop something?

    Jeff… if we shoot ‘being’ and not ‘appearing’, then yes, after a while, with a solid body of work, I think it’s ourselves in the pictures..

  363. civi – i will be scanning for at least the next month or two..

    a film strip of six photos every 1-2 minuets, for as many hours a day as i can stand.
    80 000 estimated negatives.. 16 ring-binders full..

    cannot edit my first book without seeing everything.. the only wqy to see everything is to do the work.
    virtually braindead

    i lost all my negatives from aged 8 till 17 – they rotted in an ex girlfriends basement..
    it must be amazing for the author of “greece in reverse” to be getting the feedback they are now getting.. unbelievable..
    GLADDY will send a camera..
    HARVEY will send a print..
    UNCLE PANOS will no doubt for a blurb book and sell prints .. just amazing..

    vissaria MAY NEVER HAVE TO GET A PROPER JOB>>>> how cool would that be?
    i’m sure this inspiration will soak in over the next month, stay for years and help cement her future, if she wants it.

    burns been great of late.

  364. a civilian-mass audience

    can’t wait for TOR CAPA…the pic with the camera …AWESOME…
    bring him in Grecolandia…I promise …ouzo will be out of the picture:)))))
    we have more FELIX and DIMAS and DARK KIDS and KATIA’S kids …and…and
    time to focus on YOU …now…You are ALL here NOWWWWWW…
    VIVA DB!!!

    I smell carnaval…and you know me…PARTYYYYYYYYY…!!!

  365. a civilian-mass audience