c’mon baby light my fire…

Brazilian model Fernanda Brandao photographed for my YOU MADE ME LEAVE book project in San Miguel de Allende, Mexico


i am supposed to be quitting this Burn bit right now….sort of announced that i would a few weeks back…too much work and i need to devote all my time to my own photography…i am doing three different projects with my own work that need my full attention…this is no time to be thinking of others….damn…everything was set for a high five very honorable goodbye until i went to Amsterdam as a guest of World Press Photo…

ok, so i met some young Burn audience, they told me how much Burn meant to them, uh huh, and then to the Magnum education blast in Toronto where i felt the effect of Burn in a very palpable way from both students and my Magnum colleagues, and then finally the coup de grace  last week a 16 yr old kid with a camera literally skateboarded into my gallery show in Colorado and said out of breath and without shaking hands, “i love Burn”..

so, how do you walk away after that? i mean it was only three or four people who said those things to me, but it is not about how many, but about the glint in their eye…sincere, warm, authentic…while i feel as though i have tried to avoid responsibility for the better part of my life, right here in my moment of total life freedom i have somehow managed to get myself into some sort of position of responsibility…freedom backfired..flipped…where did i go wrong?

and just now, just today, just an hour ago, after a long net session with Anton Kusters, the two of us structuring the way we would play the Emerging Photographer Fund Grant finalists starting tomorrow, we both ended up laughing hysterically…Anton with his own Yakuza book almost hot off the press was with me in thinking we would let Burn go…pass it on to others, or just let it go….and yet the reason we were laughing so hard was because in a moment of artistic and personal clarity, we saw that Burn was not fading for us, but getting ready to take on a new life…

for sure, our ten finalists this year will be our benchmark for now and set a tone for the future….exciting yes, and for sure to be controversial as well…if you have everybody agreeing with you, or have any sort of dogma attached to photography,  in any direction, then  for sure it would be time to go home…light a few fires, and you might just be getting somewhere…

no, we will not keep playing the same song…we will always be looking for fresh vision…and this year all of our candidates have it …fresh, new vision..yes, some purely journalistic, and yes, some purely conceptual…are we the arbiters of a new age of photography? of course not…in this new age, the readers choose…on the other hand, we have taken it upon ourselves to have a birds eye view of who is doing what , where and why…i have young students from all over the world, see so much work coming into Magnum, all of us see thousands of entries here on Burn, and make sure we see what is going on at all the international photo fests and pay attention to all curated shows and most recent publications of all kinds…

do we miss some stuff? sure we do, but we feel we have a reasonable handle on  what is going on as well as anyone and with no attachments commercial or otherwise to lean anyone anywhere for any reason other than to celebrate pure creativity… and we personally see a world where the various worlds of photography blend…something i have tried to do my whole life never being satisfied with labels….for sure we will blend on the pages of Burn all styles and types of photography, both online and in print soonest with BURN02…

our greatest weakness, and yes greatest strength, is that none of us who work on Burn have a full time job with Burn…we all have to do it when we can and if we can…for one way or another, we all do other things…all of us are photographers first…struggling as are all….none of us are business types, and the raw commercialization of Burn becomes less likely day by day….we want to get better, but none of us want to get negatively bigger…so we may do some things which will bring us enough funding to get a new infrastructure web wise etc., to totally display the amazing archive of stories we have for example, but all of us on Burn care more about a clean initiative than about a real biz plan…

we might fantasize a benevolent patron, and all that we do finance here comes from these generous donors (readers here), but Burn will always represent our original core philosophy of celebrating  primarily the work of new young talent with just a few iconic candles on the cake from time to time to keep things credible and referenced….and even during the short life of Burn, we have seen our original emerging crowd turn into the established crowd right before your eyes…again, we will soonest make the archive easier to access , so if you do not remember, you will be able to more easily go in and have a peek…..

Every other day we’ll show you one of our ten finalists for the EPF… and on June 11, at 10am, one of these finalists will be announced at the LOOK3 Festival to receive our $15,000 grant….

three distinctive jurors (who will now go unidentified, so you cannot influence the vote by buying them a drink) will decide on the recipient over the next two weeks of discussion and voting….these jurors will be of course identified on the day of the award…

in the coming days, we will also reveal the “short list” of 200 special  candidates out of the around 1,000 entrants and the even “shorter list” of 30 or so who came very close and are all very good….all of these will be considered very likely for publication on Burn …

i wish we had enough financing to help more than we do…and maybe someday we can have the equivalent of five of these grants or perhaps more assignments….right now, we are doing the best that we can…it is pretty obvious we are a very small rogue operation ….yet hopefully we are at least setting some examples for the larger media companies who in theory could do what we are doing way way better….but to be the small garage band has an appeal second to none really…suits me for sure…i hope it works for all of you as well…


405 Responses to “c’mon baby light my fire…”

  • & I love you and the burn too!
    So glad you are not going anywhere… you are the glue

  • David, Anton, et al., thank you so much for all that you do. I know that this really a labor of love for you, or you wouldn’t be doing it. And I am glad that you are :-)

    David, even while your chosen work has yet to be completed, you still give of yourself to Burn. Perhaps sometimes, the work chooses you… One day, you may look back at your achievements and hold Burn in the same esteem as your books (or even higher).

  • That’s all very well but what’s the story with Fernanda? ;-)

  • David…

    Thanks for opening the next chapter… It is always a terrific ride!

    …as always I am lookin’ forward to it. Jeremy

  • I want to photograph Fernanda!

    Although I look forward to you getting all of your own work together, I must admit it brought me joy to read that you plan to hang with burn for awhile yet. I just did not know what would happen to this experiment without you. I do not think there is anyone to replace you in this role.

    I look forward to seeing the top entrants from this year’s competition.

    I had thought about entering, but changed my mind. I leave it to the young.

  • Not even Jim Morrison could have said it better….. C’mon Baby Light My Fire!!

  • …you know we couldn’t get much higher…

  • come on baby…
    light my fucking fire!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    thanks for all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    ok…I see FERNANDA!!! and I like FERNANDA…can someone tell me in two,three words…
    what is going on?

    Did she light …the fire?…? NEW BOOK from MR.HARVEY…YOU MADE ME LEAVE?
    you made me stay…!!!

    where are my reading glasses?

  • a civilian-mass audience

    We all live in a house on fire, no fire department to call; no way out, just the upstairs window to look out of while the fire burns the house down with us trapped, locked in it”
    Tennessee Williams

    BURN is on FIRE…and we are locked in it…Yioupiiiiiiiiiiiii

  • I’ve said it before; and I’ll say it again… :-) For those of us living out in the photo world backblocks, burn is a real shining beacon. It has allowed me to make contact with so many different photographers all over the world. For that I am so grateful to David, Anton and anyone else who has helped out behind the scenes.

    And David; as for what you want or need to. Just follow your nose to wherever “feels” right. It seems to have stood you in good stead so far! :-) Thank you all; Burn is a pretty damn fine place to hang your hat!

  • DAH,
    you said in your keynote “I’m a family builder”.
    Burn is family.
    I love burn, too.

  • So, Harvey, does this mean you turn into a pillar of salt?

  • marcin luczkowski


    “Burn” is like pretty woman and David consider to say YOU MADE ME LEAVE, but I see he change his mind and continue this love affair for a while ;))


    I have 8 years old boy’s mind and I also say “I love Burn”. I hope it’s count.
    let the light burn forever.

  • Sitting in the middle of more than 130 athletes from 19 nations, competing since yesterday through tomorrow for qualification to the paralympic games.. reading BURN gone light (love it), reading David wondering how it comes he is where he is.. smiling big time.. you get what you deserve, as simple as that.. and that goes for Anton as well.. ok, back to my kids, but not without saying a big THANK YOU to David, Anton and the rest of those who make this place what it is :)

  • Wow someone turned on the lights…
    David, don’t forget that you have at least a few dozen people around the world willing to help out any way they can… only thing you’ve got to do is ask…

  • DAH, Anton and everyone who brings Burn to the table, I think that the comments here say it all: this is a special place and we thank you for it. For the young photographer this must be the best place to show work or to ask for advice. I’m sure that the work of the EPF finalists will be ….. free in spirit i.e. expect the unexpected!


  • @ DAH & ANTON: Thanks a lot for the infinite energy that, you guys, put here on Burn!
    @ EPF: Can’t wait to see the finalists stories and a big respect for their works and efforts to become great emerging photographers!

    Hasta la proxima!

  • Mike; And wouldn’t it be cool if the 16-year old (and his peers) who skated in to the exhibition felt comfortable enough to contribute to the dialogue. It’d bring a pretty neat added dimension!

  • so funny..
    looking forward to seeing the epf 10 – good luck to you all..

  • DAVID,

    Nice surprise to see this new Burn “light” layout…. I have to say that I am eagerly waiting to see the new talents/ photographers you have selected for the EPF this year… A nice tradition now for a few years… and I am glad to hear that the ride isn’t over yet…. I know you know that for so many of us this place is where we like to gather, read, discover new work…. whether we write often or not, does not really matter…. we are not very far… always checking…. I wish I could be at Look 3 this year to see mnany of you who I am sure will gather and have a great time… a special place and some very special memories….

    Now having said that, I do agreed with John… what is upo with Fernanda?? Far too may attractive women in the neighborhood…not goo for your heart :):):)… Take care David and as awalys,



  • David and Anton…
    Thanks for staying!
    I was a bit worried last night when I read your post refering to a new dialogue…sort of ‘lost’ my job this week thanks to my injury and I don’t want to lose anything else important in my life right now…:)
    I just hope your personal projects won’t suffer, so if help is needed just please ask…

    Paper is hot but you’re even hotter :))

  • White background is burning my eyes :-D

    PS: Feliz cumpleanos Panos! Big party tonite? Take care, buddy

  • DAH,

    a great surprise this morning, and a big thanks! Yep, we’re on fire babe!

    As I’ve said it here before (and once on Road Trips), I’m always amazed at the amount of time and energy you put in Burn, how you make it work in your busy schedule and aside from your own work… ‘mca’ is right, you are the glue here. And Burn is a truly awesome place you built (with Anton and your gang)!
    Many here -mostly burnians in silence- are the skateboarding kid who just said ‘I love Burn’… I know I am, and you’ve been an inspiration for so so many others out there -through your work, your ethics, your guidance, but also for Burn! You know it, but it’s cool to ‘feel it’…! And I’m sure you’ll eventually find a way to pass this bright burning flame to someone else along the road (once it is standing on its own and is even more of an example for the new world out there!).

    PS: judgment day is -again- supposed to happen today ;) so here’s my final word (as I’ve never said it to you in person when we met) : Thank you David!

    Best, Tanguy.

  • white is alright :o)
    link text colour maybe too pale?

  • Ah well, I was okay with you just letting it go, long the lines of classic romantic notions—better to burn out than to fade away; the fire that burns brightest doesn’t burn longest; the hero exits the stage after the big triumph… But selfish me is happy. As I know you know, I enjoy burn and have a great appreciation for your efforts. And if it starts getting stale, you can blow it up at some future date.

    Just connected with the IPhone to see what Bowen and others are talking about. I’m okay with the white, but the text is a bit difficult to read. Could be darker, I think. And speaking of html 5, I just bought and downloaded an app called Hype for creating it. Easiest web tool I’ve ever used. Incredibly simple to create pages with timeline animations. Made this page in a couple minutes after watching the intro video.

  • good fun had by all(OK most) ……………


    yes, we will be tweaking out the shades of white and gray…all screens a bit different and the difference is more apparent with white or shades thereof….we are working on it…and of course we intended this just to change for the EPF and then go back to black or green or yellow or red or whatever…

    MW,JIM, my sentiments exactly…not going for longevity…heaven forbid…i am keenly aware of staying on stage too long…searching always for a young team to come in and take over….yes, MW laughing..imagining you and i blowing up this car out on a dark street after the engine quits!…but, as i said in the text, it is not about us..it is about you…i have generally been good my whole career about balancing things…no, i cannot tie my shoes nor know the difference between firewire and usb or use Photoshop but i do seem to luckily have a sense of the symbiotic relationships of life and work….if a few pick up on that and can use that for themselves, then cool…that’s all…

    and also the very very interesting thing which has happened here and that is the very interesting position we are in right now…known, but not owned….hard to get to that point in this world we live in…always my aim as an individual, and my aim also with Burn…we can do whatever…the audience can take it or leave it and we are the same….nice..

    cheers, david

  • Jamie Maxtone-Graham

    Burning white hot.


    well, now that is cool..give your imaginary “son” a big hug from us please….by the way, sorry you could not get to Amsterdam…i would truly love to meet you…hard to imagine i have met so many readers here from all over the world and somehow have not met you my oldest long time loyal funny intelligent reader!! is there any way you can get to Paris end of June? Magnum party etc…you would be my special guest if you can make it….


    yes, i know…you have offered and we will take you up on it at some point…right now both Anton and i have books coming , so our main effort is going to be on those….you know my friend how that is!! we will see what happens…book publishing is a possibility for Burn, but we have to be realistic..or do we? counting on you my friend


    fire burns paper….ashes to ashes, dust to dust….sure, what’s new?

    in the meantime,let’s do something! i just look at one day at a time…starting with today….are there any others?


    i love the portrait of your daughter on Facebook…get it off there, and on here!

    abrazos, david

  • Most love the burning part but what happens after is when the fun starts


    well sure…and nobody has a better handle on that than you….although your last link doesn’t work for me ..technically i mean

  • should be ok now or this one http://www.webenfreude.com/ …..this guy was on fire even stopped the truck so he could make sure that I knew it

  • words later, gotta fly :)))

  • Ross, “Mike; And wouldn’t it be cool if the 16-year old (and his peers) who skated in to the exhibition felt comfortable enough to contribute to the dialogue. It’d bring a pretty neat added dimension!” …. yes Ross, very cool.

  • Sorry to interrupt the BURN love fest. But I came across a very cool posting on the Denver Post.

    The images, “by photographers of the Farm Security Administration/Office of War Information, are some of the only color photographs taken of the effects of the Depression on America’s rural and small town populations. The photographs and captions are the property of the Library of Congress and were included in a 2006 exhibit Bound for Glory: America in Color.”


    Anyone who loves looking at old photos…. this is great. We see so little color from this time in our history.

  • The world has clearly ended, and we have entered an alternate universe. Cool.

    Mr Harvey, that picture is smokin’, certainly lights my fire.

    Many thanks for all that has taken place here, upwards and onwards. I love burn.

  • Pete…

    Saw that link sometime last year great stuff.

  • Where is that 16 year old Kid with his skateboard :)))?

  • David…
    If all goes well, me and Ioanna will attend the Photo+Art Book Hamburg in September… publishing a book, as you well know, is only half the task… promotion and distribution is the name of the game… I could take my copy of Burn-01 with me to have on display as well…


  • PAUL

    Just noticed that the Post story was from last year. Saw the link to it on NPPA front page. Guess they are not really on top of it… LOL

  • Pete…

    Well it doesn’t matter, this kind of stuff is like good wine, the older the better :)!
    My head honcho “collects” cognac and he once gave me a bottle his father had bought in 1956 in some old Spanish bar… Wow that stuff could knock an elephant out old cold it was sooooooooo strong!! The thing is he has loads of bottle dating throughout the last century, he showed me a bottle from 1915 which I thought was incredibly cool until he pointed to six dusty bottles in his cellar which were real authentic vintage cognac supposedly dated sometime after the French revolution …

  • You guys are doing such an amazing job. Thank you for creating this wonderful platform for all of us to enjoy and get inspired by.
    Grtz from Karachi

  • Karachi…! Wendy be safe:)

  • damn…can i still apply for EPF????? im almost done…laughing…oh well, next year!
    HOW CAN YOU NOT LOVE BURN???????????????????
    or as CIVI would say : what NOT to LOVE?

    (PS: Vissaria, i love you)…Vissaria is another Gemini btw…June 13th…, her birthday…luckiest day of the year..good light y’all…)

  • PAUL,
    and the rest of the guitar afficionados/players out there..question: i need to buy me an acoustic guitar ..my budget is “pawn shop” size, if u know what i mean..any suggestions? through the net? or any place in LA or even Texas? any secret website (i would prefer internet purchase) that i can buy a cheap guitar that can stay in tune for an hour? the only chords i use is C, F, Dm, G, A and sometimes Bm…thats all…laughing..
    not trying to be jimmy page nor hendrix…any suggestions?

  • Just said this under mary anne’s images. David has given us like a power and feeling of no one knows but me andI can create/take this idea(s) any direction i want-you can’t make/tell me a damn thing i have to do-child like. At 60 like dorothy, I had it all along-door is open-now dammit step through-evolve. if you have brain like mine, started 30 years ago, got forked in the road now AD (after david) can just do and have (godly) experience-NOT achievement leibovitz style or any others. Ref all James Thurber Carnivale.

  • Panos…

    I’ve never bought a guitar over the net, so I have no idea who is a safe purchase on the web. The sort of guitars I used to buy took months of quietly trying everything new that came into the local shops. I was always looking out for new guitars with pretty new wood with great sound qualities, not very usual in new guitars, but there are always freaks of nature.
    But anyway you’re living in LA and you can’t get much closer to the rock scene although I wouldn’t be surprised if in Texas there was some good second hand guitar shops… there’s a strong blues following round there. I know there are a couple of good shops in NY best friend who knew what I was searching for brought me back a lovely Yamaha electric.
    Just make sure the neck is pretty straight and no cracks throughout the body…shake it a little just in case something is amiss in the soundbox and try and look inside for any cracks or suspicious glue marks.

  • a civilian-mass audience

    BURN is HOT
    BURN is ON
    come on babe
    BURN us ALL…

    Happy B-day to All my BURNIANS…I am drunk…no comment…

  • a civilian-mass audience

    please,don’t drink and drive…

    don’t to as civilian…DoASHARVEY…


  • marcin luczkowski


    Paris is almost as good as amsterdam for meeting. Oh, I wish i could be there! But I am almost 100% sure I could not make it. June will be very bussy time for me. I trully regret I can’t be so mobile as many of burnians are.
    But The Day will come. Paris, Rome or New York.

  • Hey, I notice the site keeps looking better and better throughout the day. Just about perfect now with that well-lighted photo of the beautiful woman on the bed. Not so sure it’s going to work so well when you have pics with other color combinations though. The thing about grey is that although it’s not so interesting in itself, it works with everything. We’ll see, eh…

  • But man, men, whatever, I gotta emphasize, by my tastes as a designer, which are similar… It does look perfect right now. Incredible photo. Design built to enhance it.

    Great example of why it’s so great you all are free of commercial constraints. The effect would be like totally trashed if there were a blinking add for Adorama or B&H blinking in the sidebar.

  • Is there anyway I can make Burn automatically update comments or “refresh” itself a bit like Facebook? Baring in mind I’m not using a Mac :)

  • paul

    in firefox there should be a menu item somewhere called “refresh page every…”

  • Doris Day on photography…:)))))))

    “I’m wild again, beguiled again,
    a simpering, whimpering child again.
    Bewitched, bothered and bewildered am I.”

  • Wow…snow blindness in late May. I wonder what I didn with my shades…

  • AKAKY..

    if my memory serves me correctly, which it sometimes does, you were the one who advised us against black in the first place and made the case very clearly for going white…now surely someone with a whole lot more energy than i have right this minute can go back and find the Akaky comments to which i refer…but i do have my shades on at the moment…

    cheers, david

  • MW….

    i am curious…you say the site got better throughout today with the “addition of the photo of the woman on the bed”..hmmm, we posted the story with this photo in the first place…tech glitch, or you did not notice her the first time around?

  • Perhaps bad typing on my part? What I meant was that everything around the woman on the bed has been changing throughout the day. If that’s not been happening, well, I guess it’s just another flashback type experience. Shifting colors and all, you know. All good. Regardless, one of the best web pages I’ve ever seen. Someone should take a screenshot. And I need to step away from the computer… no doubt. Too much looking at my photos and websites causes some projection, I’m sure.

  • You’re not leaving???

    WOOOOOOO HOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Burning party over here, then!!!

    (my informal degree course – Burn, photobooks, working my own projects – remains intact. I am ecstatic)

  • …did not notice her the first time around?

    Just to be clear, ummm, yea, I did. I may be going blind, but I’m not there yet…

  • Of course, and no doubt due to some combination of old age and pathetic wonkishness, the first thing I noted about her was how she was lit. And my wife’s not looking over my shoulder as I type this, I swear.


    hmmm…know Thurber (a fan mostly) know Leibovitz(a fan of some) and know “others”(a fan depending) but lost on your translation..another try?

  • a civilian-mass audience

    Mike R
    November 30, 2010 at 8:27 am
    DAH, with the new design, is it possible to try photographs displayed on a white background as opposed to the current black? If the photograph contains dark areas in the outer area it currently tends to bleed into the black background at present – at least for me. This would probably mean that text would become black on white also. Worth a try?


    david alan harvey
    November 30, 2010 at 8:32 am
    MIKE R..

    sure, we will look at that of course…i know many prefer black on white…we looked at that over and over again on this design, and ended up with black…we could do that or anything in between…please note that a new dialogue post is up…you gotta keep up!! smiling…

    I’m Civi…with energy to BURN…don’t drink and post…I am looking for AKAKY?:))))))))))))))

    can I go now…?

  • Admin…

    Thank you :)

  • a civilian-mass audience

    No…I can’t go now…

    the Benchmark is coming…!!! Wake up BURNIANS…dam..dardam…

    BURN is HOT
    BURN is ON…
    Come on Babe
    lights Us ALLL…

  • a civilian-mass audience

    PAUL…we are not sleeping,amigo…VIVA …:)!

  • we’re ‘not posting’

  • a civilian-mass audience

    dam…daradam…two toenails left…damdara..dam

  • actually – i did just write a long post under an essey.. yet before i pushed ‘submit’ my son woek up..
    grateful pause..
    will re-read in the morning post-whiskey..

    two toenails left?
    you need a washburn steal strung electro-acustic, with the lovely action, narrow neck and a small pignose amp… ad a sure harp mic and you’re ready to busk..
    or was that panos?
    yep – panos – you need a washburn steal strung electro-acustic, with the lovely action, narrow neck and a small pignose amp… ad a sure harp mic and you’re ready to busk..

    civi – get a pedicure.

  • i accidentally gave away my washburn when i emigrated..
    although i do not think i actually “gave it away”.. my friend insists that i did..
    and they would..

  • a civilian-mass audience

    hmmm…I can’t keep my eyes open…I see white sheeps…
    and…no need for pedicure…all gone now…

    I will be back …when my rooster calls….

    LOVE YOU ALLLLL…don’t you dare change this BURNING dial

  • yesyes..
    have read a story
    dreamed a dream..
    sleeping soundly again

  • I hate this white background. Takes away from the photos displayed.

  • Panos,

    My one and only acoustic guitar is a Rogue (the house-brand of Musicians Friend). No, it’s not a Martin or Gibson, but is very playable at $79 with free shipping:
    My wife & daughter bought a guitar/mandolin combo for me at that price a few years ago.

    Mine is about 4 years old, and seems to get better as it ages. I really like the neck, although the sound is not as balanced and “mellow” as I would like. Hard to go wrong at the price, unless you find a lower-end Yamaha or Alvarez in a pawn shop.

  • I love this white background. Gives the photos a more elegant presentation.

  • a civilian-mass audience

    Goodmorning MY BURNIANS…!!!

    the dance has started…with DARIA…

    and I am dancing…with no nails…at all:)))

    BURN is LOVE!!!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    BURN is Peace!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    BURN is photography!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    BURN is too white:)

  • marcin luczkowski

    White background is perfect!
    Only the audience names are too bright.

  • Love that “white turn” / I have been a long-time follower for light colors backgrounds …

    Can’t wait to see the rest of EPF 10.

    Bonne continuation to the BURN team (amazing work) & followers !

  • LOVE the new design!

    Happy hugs, audrey


    if we think you will hate it, then that is what we do….smiling

    cheers, david

  • I feel very proud of being one of Burnians… :))

    My heart is burning for photography, too.

    We are all cheering each other… very good motivation…

    David and Anton, Thank so much!!!

  • Love the new look.

    Morning coffee. Birds singing. New day.

    Great light!

  • Jim Powers hates something. Water is wet.

  • “I will pay back times ten in my efforts to create the best new leading edge photo driven magazine on the net.” – DAH

    Veni, Vidi, Vici Redux :)

  • David and Anton….Don’t let the fire burn out…Let it burn brighter…Burn rocks.

  • I’ve been all morning thinking about the comment I made yesterday on David’s photo of Fernanda and I think I must appologise for making such asinine and sexist comment…
    So especially Fernanda and course David, my sincerest apologies.

  • Has the white background got less bright? Or is it because I’m browsing in daylight and feeling refreshed, rather than late at night feeling tired? Last night, the whiteness was painful, now much less so. Hmmm.


    as with all things here, we are constantly evolving…sort of a nice symbiotic combo of “doing our own thing” and yet trying in the best sense of it to keep you guys happy and interested…but more in the same way i would try to do the same if invited over to my house for a gathering..a party? well, sort of..my parties always follow workshops, shows, openings etc…so as my guest i want you to be happy to be buzzed…

    but i will do it in a way that is natural for me as well…aren’t those the best gatherings? no pretense…some would prefer another type of gathering and that is where they should go..but some will like it here…

    of course always open discussion on better ways to do things…we are here ONLY to give a leg up for new into the biz photographers as you…to answer your specific question , yes the white is less white..we still have some programming to do to get it exactly where we want it…

    by the way, i know you had something for me to see and i have totally lost track of it…my schedule was just crazy there for awhile..can you re-send everything? please….sorry about that…i eventually get to it all, but sometimes it takes more time than originally planned…thanks for your patience..

    cheers, david

  • a civilian-mass audience

    yeah…and I am old…and I can’t see my name that clear…
    Am I fading…:)))))))))
    or it might be the ouzo…mixed with water…

    BURN is HOT and PAUL, no worries…FERNANDA is Hot too…

    What not to love !!!

    P.S EVA…big hugs to our boys…!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    AKAKYYYY…here I am…100 for you ;)

  • I’m really enjoying Alex Webb’s “Suffering of Light 30 Yrs of Photographs” highly recommended especially if you don’t own all his books. Now this gentleman has such an original eye for composition and colour it’s amazing you can stare at one image I find so many things going on.

  • Vissaria Skoulida

    Dear Mr.David A.Harvey,

    I am 10 years old and I love Burn.
    Thank you very much.

    Happy Birthday.
    for you and your friends. strawberry and chocolate.

    I love burn.

  • PAUL

    the 16 yr old is coming to Burn as per your suggestion…and as you can see he is in the senior class compared to Vissaria , the youngest photographer to be published here on Burn besides myself!!

    the photograph of Fernanda is from a series of works published assuming you and others would have a reaction for sure, and so she and i have combined “our resources” and collaborated in a moment..the thing i am trying to do with that series is in some way similar to what i am trying to do with Burn in terms of mirroring what i just do anyway…not “trying to make” something..so, i make it real..genuine..authentic…that moment with Fernanda, whatever you see, is what it was..i don’t think that sort of thing can be faked even w pro model and pro photog….i do understand your reaction, yet i also understand your apology …i would have made the same had i written the same…i am sure that Fernanda would smile and understand…she is a first class human being to be sure….

    i have not seen Alex’ new book…but of course am familiar with all of his work…he his certainly a photographer for all to study…i will try to do an interview with him here soonest…he was on Burn last year to answer questions i think..didn’t he and Becky do that here for their Cuba book?

    cheers, david

  • David…

    Yes I remember reading in silence Alex and Rebecca’s answers here on Burn! Can’t wait to ask some questions if they come back.
    BTW will we still be seeing Sally Mann on Burn at Look3 answering questions?

    Between you and Fernanda there seems to be a magical touch and you can tell there’s absolute trust on her behalf.

  • I’m very please to hear the 16 year old will soon be round here and as Mike R and Ross mentioned an extra dimension and some more fuel for our summer night campfire!

  • PAUL

    well, i do not think i will see Sally at Look3…but she and i are going to be seeing other soonest just to hang, so i will see what kind of mood she has for an interview…

  • Civi.. reporting from Lake Garda, on the road to Switzerland, pit stop for a court date the morn.. YIKES.. our boys and one girl made the worst performance EVER.. yikes.. might have a pic or two on the roll though.. AND might have big big news on a personal level, photography related.. can’t tell yet.. crossing fingers and toes, eyes and whatever else crossable there is.. waiting for decent net accessto hop over in the EPF aisle.. AND Italians seem to have woken up, c’mon, you Greeks can too!!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    EVA…my greek people are not ready yet :(…and I am angry…
    it might be the ouzo…mixed with water…
    BUT,BUT as long as I live

    I will fight…like YOUR kids…never give up…!!!

    P.S…damnit…even BURN turned white…
    I believe…together we can do miracles…Revolution

  • a civilian-mass audience

    today I feel like…”Grimsvotn”…

    ready to erupt…Revolution…

  • DAVID/ANTON :)))

    First, let me apologize for not chiming in sooner….has been an intense 2 weeks, and 1 more week left of night teaching…let free for the summer to write and finalize the book dummy…so, just a quick follow up:

    David: so happy you have decided to remain at the helm. I know you want be disappointed when I say that ‘i told you so!’…Just as I’ve told you privately, and reminded you last Monday, you do have a responsibility to BURN :)))…you created this, you had the vision and the optimism to create no only an online workshop, an online family, and online photography magazine, but what separates this from the others is that the Magazine has functioned as a school…a portal…an entity in which to both inspire and demand work is done….the EPF is one of the most significant accomplishments…and that was your vision….and so many other wonderful online magazines have followed suit….as you know Visura, that wonderful magazine modeled after the same love of photography and generosity to give back to others, was inspired by what you’ve accomplished, even now to the point where they too try to provide funding for photographers. this is a model that few have really realized. As a photographer, I don’t ‘need’ BURN, but my life would be accountably empty without it…without the conversation and the inspiration….as I told Marina long ago, part of my commitment to BURN is not only my love and friendship and respect for you, but my belief along side yours of helping and giving back….of forwarding the dialog and the belief that we are all connected and they we enrich one another in this connectedness….as Maggie Steber said, you don’t have the right to step aside ;))))….you birthed this, and as all parents, you are now responsible ;)))))…for good and ill….and i cannot imagine writing so much here, or even given Looming without the understanding that this ship is being helmed by you and Anton….life evolves…and you must above all be true to your work and produce that work, including your book on Rio and (I hope) your book “you made me leave”, and as i said here last week to you, i really hope that you accomplish and publish both Rio (YOUR rio, not just the work from your NG project) and ‘you made me leave’, but at this point, for me, what you have contributed as a publisher, and most importantly as an educator and as a leader, is equally as important….much of your work will stand time, no doubt, but i also believe that you shall help more more with what you’ve accomplished here and with your epf…..because you’ve enable people to believe in themselves and in their life as story tellers, even if they never ‘make it’…..and that is the gold in the hay that you have spun….

    if you and anton were to leave, i would too…rather, i would still write, but it would be with a heavy heart….

    as for the YOU MADE ME LEAVE…as i told you, stories that make a difference (written or photographic) are born of the peculiarities of the author, of their inimicable nature…and if there are 3 things that David Alan Harvey loves without abandon, they are: 1)family, 2)photography and 3) women…and i think some of your best, most honest, most inspired work is contained in this series…i know, i’ve seen 3 versions so far, and while some may fluff it off as not ‘hard core’ documentary, i would remind them that the most powerful and most visionary of work comes when the author is carving something from the skin of their own life…and i want that book, i want to see it…and in many ways, i hope it makes it out before ‘off for a family drive’…because you made me leave is really (to me) about family…about the search for family and its meaning…..and it just rocks….

    Anton: big big congrats…you’ve done so much and as you know, when we first started writing long before BURN was a thought, i reminded you that to make sense of a life means to put yourself into the place you desired, simple fit or awkward, and your book is an example of that….from those dark, brooding slow exposure pics in the tokyo bar years ago, to the workshops in mexico to the beautiful, meditative color songs they’ve become….i’m very happy and proud of you…

    as for WHITE…I love the white…my only suggestion is to change the fonts so we can read it easier, quicker…..but all things need time…

    ok, off for the day


  • a civilian-mass audience

    whatever BOBBY said…

    and I do Love you ALLL…ehm…that’s a quick follow up:))))))))))

  • bob

    it has been a long long way indeed… the book is almost there, just printed and now being bound… and every time someone leafs through the dummy, the past three years come back to me

    back then i had no idea what direction i would go… and to be honest now even less…. but i like it that way… and looking back i do feel some little pride that the images along the way became real… friends for life along the way here at burn…

    soon more…


  • Whew!! Where to begin?

    First of all, there are many reasons for my long silence, the most recent of which is that I just got out of the Intensive Care Unit at the local hospital a few days ago. Also explains why I didn’t wish Bob Black a Happy Birthday (I couldn’t forget it, it’s the same as my 2nd ex-wife’s).

    Second, DAVID and ANTON… congratulations on your joint epiphany… shall I call it the “Phoenix” Realization… how the fires of BURN consume you, yet you are continually reborn in the flames?… many, many people are very glad that the two of you will be sticking around for a while yet in some capacity.

    Third, looking forward with much anticipation to the EPF Finalists, the Award itself, and BURN 02.

    Fourth, for technical reasons I don’t begin to understand, I am not yet seeing the infamous new “white background” but still getting the old dark grey background with white text (???). Maybe because I am viewing on my old computer with antediluvian browser… I will take a look on my new computer in a day or two, but if it’s white, I’m sure I will be with Jim Powers on this one… I will hate it. I want to point out that the dark grey background with white text, in fact that exact shade of dark grey, is exactly what I used (and still use) on my own built-from-scratch website that pre-dates BURN and even ROAD TRIPS by several years… it is also the color of matte I use whenever I matte and frame enlargements for people (I do leave a 1/4 inch white margin between photo border and beveled matte edge). Can’t stand photos with all-white mattes and have never understood their popularity.

    Fifth, PANOS!
    I have played the guitar (and banjo, harmonica, recorder, and several other instruments, but mainly the guitar) since 1963, both acoustic and electric, been in a number of semi-professional bands over the years, have my own style, and would have been a professional musician except I am definitely a morning, not a night person, cannot tolerate cigaret smoke, and am a mediocre singer at best. This is not to brag, only to tell you I know of what I speak on the subject of guitars. I have over the years owned more than a dozen pretty good guitars of my own and played many, many dozens more.. and my strong advice is, don’t buy anything new… because even fairly expensive guitars today are not made from as good materials as even cheap guitars were made from 30 years ago, because any guitar made from decent materials will sound better the more it is played and the older it gets, and because if the neck is going to warp, it’ll probably happen within the first two or three years. In a town like LA there must be many places carrying used instruments on consignment… don’t buy off the net, but play as many guitars as you can with your own hands and the one that feels right, sounds right, to you… and that you can afford, ‘natch… is the one to buy. (I’m assuming you don’t want to spend $6,000 on a really classy instrument… yes, really good guitars cost as much as Leicas). But don’t be fooled by brand fetishism… forget the name on the peghead, just play the thing until you find one that feels and sounds (both are important) right. Good luck!

    OK, everybody, I had a little medical emergency, a brush with mortality, the other day… was found passed out in a pool of blood, vomited up more blood when I became conscious, was taken by firemen medics (BURN, Baby, BURN!) in an ambulance to the emergency room (just like on ER), and spent two days in intensive care. I am out now, still weak and a little shaky, but certainly alive. It was a freak occurence (stomach ulcer and a burst blood vessel) that will probably respond well to treatment, but I was nearly camped out in the desert miles from nowhere when it happened… fortunately (?), it happened in town with friends nearby. (It would have been a very painless way to go). My biggest concern now is the impending sticker shock from this little melodrama. Incidentally, it happened on my 64th birthday. First time I have been hospitalized overnight in my life.

    But, the week before I was in photographic heaven, backstage at the Vancouver Korean Dance Festival where I now have total access and VIP status. In the coming days I will be posting just a few of the more than 700 photos I took. So, whatever happens, I really have no regrets.

    Best wishes to all,

  • Whoa, Sidney, welcome back to the land of the living.

  • a civilian-mass audience

    “Most of the important things in the world have been accomplished by people who have kept on trying when there seemed to be no hope at all.”
    Dale Carnegie

    THANK YOU ANTONNNNNNN…!!! I would like my copy …Hot…and signed!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    SIDNEY…my Sir SIDNEY…how can we help…?

    I still have your list,your book list…thank you.

    BURNIANS are here for YOU!

    Im watching the movie/documentary HYPE…
    amazing, watching Charles explains and show his grunge work!
    big hug to Felix
    see u soonest

    so glad you are safe and out of the hospital…heal well and quickly, friend. *m

  • Sydney; Thank goodness everything worked out for you…. Take care ok?

  • SIDNEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    just saw your post above ..thank u about all guitar advice.. i will do as u say..
    feel better, get better..like civi said: anything we can do to help????????????????


    shout out to you… ive been wanting to see if you had email available however it is difficult for me to determine if you have even any time left in your day.

    i just want you to know that i am amazed at our polarity: your infinity of knowledge and recall regarding words and poetry and the finiteness of my command of words and vocabulary…

    know also that your authenticity shines through this digital ink… i truly appreciate who you are and what you do.


    i am glad that you have shown yourself again on BURN.

    i remember mostly your frustrated comments on your eternal project of Empty Spaces and i thought and thought about them… until i woke up one day and thought about a splendid idea about how i might go about it if this project were mine.

    thanks for the inspiration.

  • CIVI… my dearest CIVI,

    i am not surprised at all that you have gained recognition. much of Burn is you and how you have kept everyone together. always light and fresh, always caring, a beacon on nite shift who has extended beyond the night into the universe.

    keep it up dearest. i have on file still katie-cakes words from way back when… i usually dig her words up when i am at a loss with mine.

  • Nice to see you back Gracie… :-)

    without Civi, would be NO burn..
    Yeah yeah, DAH created, Anton, Haik, BobB,
    And ANNA M B Jester “realized” it.. But CIVI,
    that Motherf&$&$&!g CIVI was/IS THE GLUE that kept us ALL together and under “contro”..
    and my oh my do I “hate control”…
    But CIVI did it right !
    “Saint CIVI and the Sinners”
    that should be the new Burn “album”, LP, CD.. whatever u wanna call it:)
    Big hug

  • And again:
    Big THANKS TO:
    4)BOB BLACK…

    The rest of us???? Happy tourists and shameless self promoters (and a few ugly opportunists) here and there..
    Credit goes to credit due!
    sorry if I hurt anyone’s feelings (mine included)…
    but, TRUTH to be told!

  • 5 minutes left… GO BULLS… f$$k the Heat…
    Florida sucks….


    welcome back….it is always good to have your perspectives..please stay this time


    another welcome back…so so pleased to read your well written missives here again, particularly after the medical trauma…i have no clue what i might be able to do from this end, but if there is anything, feel free to call, request by private email, whatever..will do what i can…

    white on black, black on white…a never ending discussion since i was a student…i remember well mounting prints on white board, then a few years later if work was not mounted on black board, then well it just was not worthy of discussion..just too cool for school..then, everyone tired of either black or dark gray and on and on and on..and here we are now at Burn with the same discussion…first off our intent here was just to change for the EPF finalist drum down…and that could indeed be the case…frankly i like a darker background for some photographs and lighter for others…if i were doing a mat for a print in my home , the background mat would change with each picture…for a show they would be all the same and i have seen it both way, with white of course being by far the gallery favorite…but this is a computer screen…different….in any case, we are not married to either a black/gray or white background…maybe taupe is the way to go…i have no idea…anyway, we will keep playing with shades, and tweaking, and come to some conclusion based on what most us prefer…but mostly mostly , just pleased you are back with your opinions…

    cheers, abrazos, david

  • a civilian-mass audience

    you know me…not good with writing…especially emotional stuff cause I Freeze BUT here …
    OUR KATHLEEN FONSECA…wrote it down for me :

    “Kathleen Fonseca
    May 9, 2009 at 1:23 am
    you see? you see? this is what i mean!! HOW did you know? You make me smile through my tears, just your recognition and your understanding..god, if i say you are so special, and if i say that i speak from the bottom of my heart, my gut, my nerve endings, would you believe me? please just nod yes. You don´t have to say anything. Just nod yes and i will know.
    that´s all i can say..i am a lucky, lucky katiecakes..
    sending you all my best through the ether..
    thanks, sis

    yes…as DAH said it…”please stay this time”…and yes, we found SIDNEY…and I am still looking
    for many others…

    Credit when credit due…few years ago,when MR.HARVEY opened his windows for civilians,YOU and KATIE,ANTON,PANOS,DAVIDB,BOBBY…believed in the Mass Audience,the silent readers,…because I am the silent reader,your average Joe,your civilian…damnit,I want to hug you

    and a THANK YOU to ALL,I mean all my BURNIANS…for YOUR support…no names today…
    I am in a middle of a major project…shhh…REVOLUTION

    and PHOTOGRAPHY…let’s go Green,mint like …:)

    I will be back …oime,myGRACIE…i am a happy civi…SIDNEY,I need update

  • a civilian-mass audience

    “One man may hit the mark, another blunder; but heed not these distinctions. Only from the alliance of the one, working with and through the other, are great things born.”
    Antoine de Saint-Exupery

    that’s the secret of BURN…damnit,PANOS,we greeks talk too much:)))))))))))))))))

  • a civilian-mass audience

    ohhh…and credit to all of YOU…who know civi(I mean there is a real civi)
    and you didn’t kiss and tell…not,that my name can make any difference…BUT it would be a distraction…
    cause BURN…it’s about YOU,THE PHOTOGRAPHERS…and your VISION…

    YOU made me STAY…so,all eyes ON YOU and your projects…it ain’t about civies…hiii

    Come on my Babies,light the fire…HIGH MIND/LOW LIGHT…LOOK1-2-3!!!!!!!!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    GRACIE…can I have ouzo with ice-cream…?:)

  • AKAKY: You must be the ugly opportunist here.

    AKAKY IRL: Piss off.

    AKAKY: Why the nasty mood today?

    AKAKY IRL: Vacation’s over, dammit.

    AKAKY: Yeah, I can see how that would be a major league bummer.

    AKAKY IRL: Thank you. Now piss off.

    AKAKY: Okay. Sorry to have disturbed you.

  • Had a fantastic talk and walk and lunch with the lovely Erica McDonald in NYC on Saturday. The reason I mention this is that it wouldn’t have happened without BURN. So I hope it sticks around and I get to meet more of you someday in person.



  • “Hijacked 3…
    Photographers based or born in either Australia or UK are invited to submit 12-18 digital images from a series/body of work for consideration.”


  • Harvey I approve. I’ll be watching…


    nice opener on your website….

  • Akaky..you are NOT just part of BURN..
    you ARE , Burn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • GRACIE :)))))

    thank you…and i miss your poetry…wish BURN and us all were more fortunate to have you here (and your words) more often :))))

    SIDNeY! :)))…welcome back Lazarus…and i’m am really really happy you are still with us….please, get well…and if there is anything i can do/offer, please send me a note…you’re forgiven your momentary lapse of reasoning (equating me, again, 2nd year in a row, with your ex-wife ;)) )….for i’d rather have you here than not :)))))))…hugs, biggest, from family black :)))

    Mike K :)))>..email sent :)))

    gotta fly….:)))


  • have been all the epg finalists noticed or can i keep my hopes…
    David Alan (and burn staff), what you do here for photographer fighting to get a spot in the small photography circle is almost tender. Cheers for that.

  • Bob…

    Muchas gracias, amigo!

  • Late arrival…

    David – glad you and Anton are staying on. Losing the leader of a loosely-knit group like this would be devastating. No matter how capable and hard working the new person would be, the end result would never be the same. Perhaps the initial drive would be gone or diminished, or the respect level for the replacement wouldn’t be there…whatever the case, the site just wouldn’t be the same. I could see potential for a gradual but marked decline. I could be wrong. Glad we can put off that concern…for now at least.

    As I look at the screen, I can’t help but paraphrase Poltergeist, “Run away from the white!”

  • Assisting JIM GOLDBERG in SA

    (here is a small video-shot with an android phone), showing your truly assisting JIM GOLDBERG, while Jim was shooting video- taking interview somewhere on the road from SA to Austin…
    enjoy (sorry for bad sound- it was just a phone btw)

  • Sidney, my neighbor, glad you are well, or at least better. Take care of yourself, okay?

  • a civilian-mass audience

    What are you holding PANOS…beer? are the MAGNUMS on the road? any updates?

    hmmm…and where is my beer? and my BBQ…POMARA:)…and your report JEFF? …
    and my ice-cream?…

    welcome IVAN…there is always HOPE…:)

    cause when there is hope…There is BURN…etcetera,etcetera…

  • @ PANOS: It’s a tought job to be Jim’s assistant… :-)) Seriously, it’s the best way to learn. By the way: Lakers are Out, San Antonio also… hard to see the NBA Finals without your favorite team. Forget basketball, switch to football. Saturday -> Barcelona – Manchester (CHampions league final) :-))))) I LOVE THIS GAME.

    @ DAH: Why you are not in the Magnum bus with Jim, Susan, Alec and Paolo P. Would be great to see Postcards from America by you.


  • a civilian-mass audience

    YEAHHHHHH…PATRICIOM…Viva football…can’t miss this one!!!

    and regarding MR.HARVEY….hmmm…I forgot to sign his permission slip…
    nobody leaves BURN …:)))))))))))

    oime…I better run now

  • PATRICIOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!
    GO BARCELONA!!!!!!!

    (yes i took the Lakers fall kinda seriously for a sec, but i feel better now… i just hope Phil Jackson stays one more year, although….)

  • I am Burn…oh…I thought it was a rash; so no wonder the Bactine doesn’t do anything for the damn thing. Ah well, live and learn, I guess.

  • When is the magnum bus coming to the east coast?

  • Michael K,
    That’ll be the second part of the trip.. The “plan” is a zig zag across America .. As far as I know, the success (or not) of this first trip will determine the next step…etc.. No official dates yet..
    Jared Iorio is in Fresno CA right now assisting Subotzky .. blah blah..

  • Hey man… Thanks! Hope it’s successful. Would love to see it in DC.

  • Have lots of ideas and places off beaten path in MD, DC, VA area!

  • nnSIDNEY

    I just read your comment and want to welcome you back, not only to Burn but to the land of the living. It sounds like a very close call and even though it would have been a painless way to go, all of us who know and care about you are not ready to see you pass into the sunset. I, for one, have LOTS more to learn from you. Your posts always make me think, question, often smile and occasionally scratch my head in bemusement (is that a word?) Anyway, speaking as your elder by 5 years, 64 is WAY too young to go. You’re just hitting your stride. Our bodies may not be what they used to be but we have all these years of lived experience, some of which I trust can be shared with others.

    Please give your bruised and battered body time to recover. It has been through a real trauma. And while you rest, please hang out here on Burn and post long comments. I’ve been feeling Sidney-deprived!



    Have been on the road of late so am totally unaware of what is going on here on Burn, but my screen just changed from off-white print on a dark gray background to light gray on a white background. Don’t know if this is the “new look” or just a temporary trial but, for what it’s worth, I loved the old style and find this less satisfying. Just one person’s opinion…



    we are just trying this out..maybe for the EPF only….however, the majority here do seem to prefer white…i am not so sure ….i pushed hard for the dark gray in the beginning…do you not remember the hue and cry for please please go white at the very beginning of Burn? again, one of those things where no way to please all of the people all of the time…as i said to Sidney earlier, in my earliest years i mounted prints on white, then black became the “only” way to go…now it is back to white for most gallery prints …ever gotten caught up in color swatches when thinking of painting your house outside or in? yes, the same problem here…

    cheers, david

  • I cast my vote for the white…



    i will be pushing for the magnum bus to go from new york thru blues country mississippi and ending new orleans..imagine starting in nyc, do d.c., then through kentucky, virginia, nashville, graceland, blues country, and ending up in new orleans and the gulf coast…click click click….already on it….

  • The very definition of “getting there is half the fun.”

  • a civilian-mass audience

    “All life is an experiment.”
    Ralph Waldo Emerson

    To our MISSOURI and elsewhere tornado affected People…be strong,be safe…
    may the spirits of life be with you…ALL of you…

    running…my greek people need me…”greece in reverse”…
    Poverty…not far from paradise

    I will be back…cause …”The greatest pleasure in life is doing what people say you cannot do.”

  • a civilian-mass audience

    and together we can do miracles…yeap,we can…

    If you wish to spend your time sitting around in the salon massaging an art hard on for ‘snow angel’ and comparing notes on who knows the most obscure poets, that fine.
    Just remember that a vast knowledge of work is not work.
    Work is work.



  • DAVID,

    White for the EPF finalists sounds good, then back to dark grey sounds even better.
    regarding the trip ny to new orleans – can a bus with students follow? :)

  • DAH… Let me know if I can help.

  • PAUL…

    From NOOR newsletter:

    On 25 May, Pep Bonet will hold a lecture in Palma de Majorca, Spain entitled “Mirant en Silenci” (Watching in Silence) as part of the Alternatilla festival.


    That’s tomorrow!!

  • john gaddy:

    you have a lot of balls, but we knew that already……i don’t sit around, i work my ass off…and i don’t sit around comparing who knows what…if you are referring to Daria’s work, and what i wrote, well, they’re reference to work by work she knows and that may just help contextualizing….

    if your critizing Daria’s work again, fine so be it….if youre critizing me and my life/photograhy, fine…but just because i don’t share with burn what i do, doesn’t mean i’m not working my ass off…

    you can remain embittered and slogging of people, that is cleary YOUR WORK….

    aint my own….

    peace?….your venom is so empty, why not just say what you want to say: fuck off bob….at least i’d respect you more…

    off to work mate

  • Eva…

    Thanks!!!!! Just sent an Email hope it isn’t too late!! It’s amazing I read the newspaper everyday and there’s nothing advertised!

  • Harvey, thanks for the bump. Lots going on here
    will catch you up when they post in a month or so.
    You and Civi must come for BBQ, Beer and Bluegrass.

  • John and Bob, your exchange made me smile for some reason, truly, as dark as my morning espresso roast and each sip as wonderfully caustic in their own way. C’mon, you have to admit.

  • DAH, ANTON, All…

    sorry, really don’t like the white burn… white looks great with the photos, but with so much text it’s hard work… i think if you’re gonna go with white the type needs to be darker…

    besides that… back from Sydney, too much of a good time, too much… i guess that’s what happens when you spend so long in the bush and then turn up at a photo festival…

    i was going to write a bit of a report here, met so many people,caught some great shows etc. the seminar weekend was a great experience… anyhow i’ve posted something on my blog for anyone interested.


    whats all this Gemini business??? i’m next week…

    David, i’ve got a couple of recommendations from the festival… maybe skype sometime?


  • “i will be pushing for the magnum bus to go from new york thru blues country mississippi and ending new orleans..imagine starting in nyc, do d.c., then through kentucky, virginia, nashville, graceland, blues country, and ending up in new orleans and the gulf coast…click click click….already on it….”


    Please put my name on the volunteer list for any help you need on this, especially the Kentucky/Nashville/Graceland/Blues Country part. A short stop at a bourbon distillery (98% of the worlds bourbon is distilled within 50 miles of Lexington) might be interesting. Lots of ideas for that segment…want to be involved since I’m in the midst of it geographically already…

    I kind of prefer the black/grey for the colors, although the photos seem to pop more on the current white. I think my monitor needs an adjustment though, on this scree the side backgrounds have a touch of pink or cream in them….

    NOT LONG ‘TIL LOOK3!!!!!

    good light, all!


  • a civilian-mass audience

    whatever TOM said!
    JOHN & BOBBY …when the Giants colide…!!!
    double espresso

    SAMMY,SAMMY…you nailed it…you were focused…I got reports from GLENN…
    BRAVO SAMMY…our AUSSIE mate…thank you! your birthday gift will be delivered on the 31st;)

  • a civilian-mass audience

    I love your kids…I see energy…Rock on,amigo!

    THOMAS…”can a bus with students follow? :)
    can a Bus with civilians follow too? :))))))))))

    ANDREWB…don’t forget to bring baklava…LOOK1-2-3!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    ok…after long hours of research…I got the following results:

    older BURNIANS are going for grey
    younger ones… for white…

    results inconclusive…therefore more tests need to be done…:)))))))))))))

  • CIVI : ))))

    thanks for all your support!
    you’re our champion…

    i was focused was i??? maybe for the seminar talks… but otherwise…
    well i better not go there… too much good times : ))

    wish i could get to Look 3 – i’ve got the bug now, itchy feet…
    then there’s Arles too… love a trip to France…
    Sydney cleaned me out… and some…

    family to feed…

  • Civi.. staying in your bus, can I? And regarding colours, I always seem to go against the river, liked the light version from the start and the more I look at it, the more I love it..

    Sam.. when’s your book coming out?

  • a civilian-mass audience

    SAMMY…I hear you,got to feed my chickens too…:)
    we will travel …when the time and timing is right!

    EVA…hmmm,since you are not a civilian maybe you can be our driver…
    MYGRACIE,SPACECOWBOY and MASSSS Audience …will follow the BURNING buses…


  • Eva…

    thanks for asking! i’ve just put a blurb book out, exhibition catalog, it’s a limited release just while the Head On Festival is running (until about June 12th).
    http://www.blurb.com/bookstore/detail/2114925?ce=blurb_ew&utm – hurry while stocks last ; ))

    Civi…when the time is right… i’ll drink to that!

  • Well I don’t care if it’s white or black as long as it’s hot, sweaty and BURNING!!
    Although, once upon a time in 2007 I bumped into a lovely blog which was white and this photographer took us on the most amazing Road Trip trying to find some treasure, following a map he discovered in his cereal box as a kid. – even though, he’s never had any intention of ever finding that treasure, since it would mean the end of the fiesta.

  • “When things get too heavy, just call me helium, the lightest known gas to man.”
    Jimi Hendrix.

  • @ PANOS: Yeap Barca on Saturday for sure! Great level, awesome game.
    Answer to me this question: How can American people like baseball game? Most annoying game ever invented by human kind! It’s only useful for chewing ads…

    I’m IN the European Bus (if it exists). Who’s in charged of it. Where I can fill the application form???

    @ DAH/ANTON: White works good during the day… dark grey works better at night when house lights are off. Solution: Just a button to toggle the “white” ON-OFF background. :-)

    Hasta manana, Patricio
    PS: White background works very good with the submission of Benjamin!

  • Andrew B…

    Here’s an extract from an interview with Alex Webb I thought might interest you…

    “I do not carry a camera very much in New York, unless I am working. I have to say that I am not very good about casually having the camera, occasionally taking pictures. When I am working, then I really have to work. I really have to work. I really have to stay attuned. I have to get up early in the morning, get out and I wonder and maybe the light is getting less interesting, then I eat my breakfast… I work in color, where light is really important in a very special way, so I work certain hours much more than others. I am always out at the latter half of the afternoon and in the evening. It is a whole sort of ritualistic process and a part of it is also that notion that if it is not working I just have to walk more. I do believe that there is something of a disciple. Disciple art of walking and wondering. It is not that you just drive along, jump out of the car and take a picture and get back to the car. It is really about walking and feeling the situation. How do you enter the situation. Some situations you get comfortable just walking right in. Others you have to sort of dance around the edge and come in here. The whole sense of the process, a rhythm of the process. The process of going back to a place. The process of learning about a place. When I am starting something or another, let us say I am going off to some country, I read some stuff about it, but I do not read too much before I go. I read enough to be able to work a little bit, but until I start actually visually experiencing the country, I do not want to read too much, because I do not want my intellectual knowledge to hinder the immediacy of my response. Once I get into something, then yes. I read a lot about history, politics of a place. Before I go, I do not want to know too much, because I might not see the things that are surprising and are different. What I want to experience is this sudden moment of visual insight.”

  • PAUL:
    Thank you for pointing out that link to the interview with DAH! And a side note/link….a nice article about the Open Shutter Gallery show is here:


    Will take baklava to LOOK3 – but no guarantee any will be left after the drive there!! I will stash a few pieces away for you so I’m not tempted…and is no one interested in good kentucky single-barrel bourbon? ;)

    Off to look at your blurb book – and knowing my weaknesses, it will end up in my cart :)

  • pAtrIcIO M…

    Try playing baseball and I promise you’ll probably appreciate it. Preferably on a lovely spring Saturday afternoon with some good friends and a late evening BBQ to round it off :).

  • The boy’s got a book out and doesn’t say anything.. or did I miss it?? Anyway, always happy to have a goo excuse for NOT going to buy those shoes and get a book instead :))

    Civi.. I’m much more civilian than you think.. and can drive.. as long as it’s got an engine and some wheels underneath I’m game.. better than cooking anytime..

  • No time to read through all the comments, so this has probably been said already:

    DAH – ANTON;

    When you compare Burn with the other photography magazines out there right now (and with many other magazines too), both those in print and online – Burn is clearly showing the path that they should be following. Thing is, Burn is leaving them all behind. Keeping it small and independent is the way as you’ve shown. Burn can do what it feels like, when it feels like. Burn is clearly alive and continues to grow and continues to be exciting. I’m sure if this thing is to come to an end it will be a very natural one.

    I’ve not had time to comment in recent months, but I’ve been looking at the essays and reading some of the comments. Nice to see that the loyalty is still there, that Jim is still around and that Patricia is back too. As always Bob’s comments are stimulating and Panos is there with the news. And Civi is holding it all together….

    But I think a 16 year old kid on a skateboard says it all – if he’s interested, things are RIGHT!

    I’ll have some more news soon (re. a book).

    But for now, I’m having a special print sale – all prices under £200. I have a pdf catalogue available. If anybody would like to take a look contact me via my website.

    Cheers to all and keep the fire stoked!

    Justin P

  • Eva…

    They’ve confirmed by Email they still had some free places at Pep Bonet’s lecture, should be very interesting. So off tomorrow at 6pm for a 3 hour talk, plus some kind of workshop included…sounds interesting!

  • Answer to me this question: How can American people like baseball game? Most annoying game ever invented by human kind! It’s only useful for chewing ads…
    smiling..thats one of my questions too…i never got it…but the question is simple..called TRADITION..its the way u have been raised..its the school you went to etc…remember the people in CUBA love baseball even more than Americans…its all tradition, where did u grow up etc..
    just like Religion…Christians vs Muslims and all that bullshit that destroying the world and enslaving people..
    Religion is stronger and more powerful than heroin or meth or crack..
    We all know that religions caused more DEATHS than all drugs, alcohol and cigarettes all together,…:(

  • …also caused more suffering by supporting accidental, unwanted pregnancies, kept women in captivity…oh i can write a 3000 page book over the Religion baloni (way more powerful and destructive than any tsunami or earthquake too)

  • Panos.. while you write that book.. you can also sign this petition here:


    Paul.. glad that worked out, I bet you’ll enjoy it!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    JUSTIN!!!…I hold you and you hold me…

    Believe Universe
    Revolution Now

    Gracias MR.PAUL PARKER !

    Don’t we All love DAH…?!!!

    “You made me leave”
    the lady screamed
    I had to leave
    the time had come
    BUT now…I am BURNED and I feel Free…

    WTF…I love you ALLL

    P.S EVA we have a deal!…
    PANOS,300 pages will do it…this is madness,this is Sparta!!!

  • a civilian-mass audience

    SAMMY…we drink organic Detox tea with JOHNYG…
    and we are running like BOBBY…!!!


    updates…if you can?:)

    DAH INTERVIEW http://shutterbug.com/techniques/pro_techniques/0307harvey/

    Thanks for the link,Paul. Interesting read.

    DAH, if I may I’d lobby for a full on,non-fiction book. I don’t see the reason to be concerned
    with political correctness particularly in light of the way you photograph the women in your
    personal and professional life.

    Would be curious to hear from the women, here, as to whether they would see a book of this
    photographic theme as exploitive.


  • BTW – I love baseball, and it has nothing to do with the tradition. It’s the deliberateness – when a player or team does all the little things well. Precision balanced with sheer abandon. Playing the odds.

    One of my favorite stories that encompasses what I love in baseball involves one of the pitching greats, Greg Maddox. A unassuming man, looks more lie an accountant than a professional athlete. He used to consider the pitcher/batter duel as a chess match-not just during that at bat, or that game, but throughout the season. Early in the season and in situations when an opponent scoring a run wouldn’t matter, he would serve up a ball that he knew would get crushed. That batter, thinking he had seen the best that MAddox had to offer, would get surprised later with even better pitches, whether it’s when runners were on base, later in the season or even in playoffs. I got to see him several times when he was playing and in his prime. Magical stuff.

  • I know similar questions have been asked before, but on Benjamin Rusnak’s site, it says that he has a decade of newspaper experience, been shooting for Food for the Poor, Inc. since 2000 (making the total professional career over 20 years), and has been recognized by several premier organizations and competitions. So I ask, how does he qualify as “Emerging?”

    It seems that having someone with that much experience and exposure in a competition intended for the upcoming “icons of tomorrow” stacks the deck a little. Should a professional football team compete against a high schooler team just because the pros haven’t won the Super Bowl? It is still a wonderful set of images, and Benjamin is clearly very talented. This is not intended to take away from the grant or the photographers. I am just raising the question.

  • Well, Brian, it has been asked before. The best I can understand is that if you are still breathing, you can fit the definition of emerging.

  • a civilian-mass audience

    “I embrace Emerging experience.
    I participate in discovery.
    I am a butterfly.
    I am not a butterfly collector.
    I want the experience of the butterfly.”
    William Stafford

    You are ALL buttterflies…I am a collector:))))))))))

  • Brian yes!!!!!!!!!!


  • AKAKY: You saw it, didn’t you?

    AKAKY IRL: Yep.

    AKAKY: So?

    AKAKY IRL: So what?

    AKAKY: What are you going to about it?

    AKAKY IRL: Nothing. I simply assume that your PatricioM friend is just some European who doesn’t know anything about baseball. It’s all a question of taste, you know. He probably thinks that kicking a geodesic ball up and down a field for ninety minutes is endlessly exciting. To each his own, I say.

    AKAKY: You’re being very broadminded these days, aren’t you?

    AKAKY IRL: Look, guy, it’s not like he’s rooting for the Red Sox, is it? Then he would have to be dealt with. But he isn’t. He just doesn’t like baseball. Lots of people don’t like baseball. It’s not a crime.

    AKAKY: He called it boring, for crying out loud!

    AKAKY IRL: Parts of any baseball game are boring, guy, that’s just the way it is. The difference between baseball and futbol or football or calcio or whatever the hell he calls it is that in baseball, when nothing is happening, nothing is happening, whereas in soccer when nothing is happening, everyone is running around like something is happening in the hope that no one will catch on that nothing is happening. Look at the scores; those guys run back and forth for ninety minutes and what do you get? An insurmountable 1-0 lead. In baseball, your 1-0 lead isn’t safe until the third out in the bottom of the ninth inning. Something can always happen; just remember Aaron Boone. Soccer is Sisyphean, dude, whereas baseball is Apollonarian, with occasional outbreaks of beer from the bleacher creatures.

    AKAKY: You’re getting profound in your old age.

    AKAKY IRL: Tell me about it.

  • Eva…

    yesterday was pretty much my first ‘normal’ day since my return from Sydney. over there without a laptop and crashing with friends that have small children… you can imagine, most of the time i was out and about – way too much to do : )) so… i was going to get to it, honest :) anyway, thanks for mentioning it, i’ll mention it here again in a few days.

    like bb, running,,,

    I love you for that last post. That post should be erected as monument of the brilliance that the internet can achieve. It’s Lenny Bruce brilliant filtered through the left eye of Pelé and the right eye of Babe Ruth. Word.

    Via Barça!!! Sorry, can’t help it. My papa was a rolling stone. My papa was also Man Utd fan. Which simply goes to show that perfection is logically unattainable. ;-P

    Viva L’iverpool!!! ;-P ;-P ;-P

  • a civilian-mass audience

    FRAMERS…what’s up MyLIVERPOOLIAN?:) you are a strong one…

    “Soccer is Sisyphean, dude, whereas baseball is Apollonarian”…Who is AKAKY?…:)))and
    what not to love!

    I love you ALLL…I will be inside and outside…I am trying to wake up…my Greek people!

    Keep the fire BURNING,keep your focus and don’t stop to laugh
    Laugh loud…laugh hysterically…

  • a civilian-mass audience

    and from MICHELLE…sublime…HIGH MIND/LOW LIGHT


    let it be…

  • Picking up this question from Mark:

    “DAH, if I may I’d lobby for a full on,non-fiction book. I don’t see the reason to be concerned with political correctness particularly in light of the way you photograph the women in your personal and professional life.

    Would be curious to hear from the women, here, as to whether they would see a book of this photographic theme as exploitive.”

    (thanks for posting the link, Paul)

    If DAH were a woman doing this in reverse, meaning taking pictures like the ‘You Made Me Leave’ ones of men, how would that be seen, as exploitive?

    ‘Political correctness’ is much more an US worry than a global one. Politeness, respect, consideration of the other, yes, but that’s different from PC…

    Back to ‘You Made Me Leave’.. if I’m not mistaken this will not be solely a photobook, but a book with text accompanying photographs.. or photographs accompanied by text, I think that this is where fiction comes into play here..

    BUT fiction is there also even without text and the book. Look at the picture of Fernanda above, that alone is already fiction, as we don’t know what happened.. what is/was between the two? The caption states model Fernanda.. the question that comes to mind (at least mine): model? Or something else and different and more profound? With no disrespect at all for either the photographer nor the photographed.. this picture to me works because of the question it raises, there’s mood, feeling, underlying sexuality, much more than in so many pictures one can see of half or totally naked bodies where nothing comes through but the naked bodyparts.. here’s a flow back and forth from woman to man/man to woman.. and this is true, with other feelings also, for the other pictures of this project that were screened in Amsterdam..

    As much as I would like to see a book filled just with these pictures, I’m most curious to read whatever will come along with them.. be it fiction.. or biography?

  • Sam…

    Sounds like you where on a cloud for sometime.. hard to get off, but a good boost I think.. anyway looking forward to get the book and best of luck with it!

  • Off to an all day event organised by Paul Lowe around the Collateal Damage show he has curated, featuring the work of Tim Hetherington and many others. There’s a webinar later today. If you want to join in on that, go to http://open-i.ning.com/ sign up and get involved.

  • One word to add to my lenghty comment above is sensuality… transpires from this pictures and the others of the project…

  • White Burn version. I like it!!! Yes I know i’m always late.. may be is on line since a long but this year is a busy one… I also didn’t find the time to submitfor EPG (may be it’s better like that :)))
    Ciao a tutti!! W gemini!!

  • Eva…

    Do you like William Eggleston’s work? He’s got a new book out, the reviews claim it is beautifully printed and mostly unseen photos…

    Who else likes or dislike Eggleston’s style? I know he isn’t to everyone’s taste, I must admit I’ve always been attracted to his way of seeing the ordinary. I consider him a master of the commonplace…

  • Paul…

    Eggleston’s lightbulb.. :D

    Actually he was one of the first colour photographers I discovered when starting to look at photography, along with Parr. And while I have seen every picture (and there are quite a lot) on Eggleston’s website, I have none of his books.. yet.. or better, I do have one, not by him, but about his work.. it’s by a German author and puts his early work in relation with paintings and movies.. don’t know if it’s been translated into other languages, but it’s quite interesting..

    For sure he is one to study.. so much of what we can see around tries to walk in his footsteps.. not easy at all..

    Will bookmark the link, no more books this month and probably the next :(

  • a civilian-mass audience

    Thank you Spain…we follow…my Greek people are waking up…
    We can do it…!!!

    I am out …and I will be out…keep BURNING my BURNIANS…


  • ok lets be fair to Manchester UTD too though…amazing team but mostly amazing music came out of this city…cant ignore their contribution to my well being..iPod says : Go Manchester!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • a civilian-mass audience


    in the center of broken grecolandia…waiting for you…REVOLUTION NOW

  • CIVI,

    I’m very good, thanks hon. Just getting on with getting on. Hard times, but keeping my head. Down in London end of next month, busy in the meantime up here with various things. But a happy busy, which is much better than either bored and bad busy. ;-P

  • Admin/Anton…

    The page numbers at the bottom of each page seem to disappear when you are on that page. I’m sure it’s just a font color issue, but it appears that I’m on page 2 when I’m on the last page. And the last page doesn’t show up either. For instance right now I see ‘previous, 1 3 4.’ Not 2 or 5. Is anyone else (not) seeing this?

  • ALL

    I am home after a magical trip to Los Angeles for the opening of the Beauty Culture exhibit at The Annenberg Space for Photography. In addition to having a lovely five-day visit with my sister and brother-in-law Emily and Gorsha, I was delighted to spend an afternoon with sister Burnian Anna Boyazis at her exquisite photo exhibit at the Los Angeles Municipal Art Gallery, and to hang out with Burn exhibitor Carl Bower and his wife Terri at the Beauty Culture exhibit in which he also had work.

    Sorry, Panos, we didn’t make it to Venice Beach although we did spend the weekend in the desert (La Quinta) and went to the L.A. Planetarium where the James Dean classic “Rebel Without a Cause” was filmed in 1955. I was photographing everything and so far have put up galleries with photos from the opening and Anna’s exhibit. The rest will be coming along soon. The URL is



  • Michael.. there must be a bunch of 2s floating in cyberspace ;)

  • Michael K.,

    I’m seeing it, too. The ellipsis and the last digit are there, but either they are same color as the background or so close my monitor doesn’t show any contrast. If you highlight the digits with you cursor, they can be seen.

  • A slideshow tribute to Nirvana on the GQ website:

    A couple of Charles Peterson photos on there; slides 2 and 16.

  • Eva, Paul; I’ve always loved Eggleston. Here’s an interesting interview…


  • An interesting Eggleston doco trailer; I love the statement “What am I going to photograph? Everything around here is so ugly” “Well photograph the ugly stuff!”

  • Akaky: I admit. I never played baseball, just seen few time in ESPN, and I’ve never understand the game. So, maybe that’s my major problem. I tried it, but no way.
    I’m totally agree with you when matches finished 0-0 and nothing happens. Specially in second division… But, that’s not the case in the Champions League, were level are very high, and teams rock every Tuesday and Wednesday night…

    By the way, it is a never ending discussion, football/baseball is like politics or religion… so I propose to discuss about photography.

    Abrazo grande, keep in touch

    PS: Shame on Qatar 2022! They’ve never played football, they don’t even have stadiums, temperatures are above 40 degrees Celsius and they will host the World Cup!!

  • Patricio; You should try explaining the rules of cricket to someone who doesn’t understand the game; all you do is make them even more confused! :-) They’re always amazed that you can play a game that lasts 5-days and it still ends up a draw… :-)

  • Thank u Pat… Checking :))))

  • i love photography and i love that people here love photography.
    too many book clubs and equipment fetishists online..
    too many theorists and too few grafters..
    very few theorists who graft..

    photography is a big old bag.. as is music.

    whenever i talk to someone about music and they ask what my “fav band” is, the answer is always non specific – i like *good* music.. good dependent upon defenition.

    in fact the question dulls me as much as “which have been your fav gigs for photographs”.
    was it sitting in the second row of john mclaughlin in 92, munching on hash cookies, or thrashing out some chemical issues a handful of years later with prodigy?
    whats “better” – the strawberry or raspberry?

    professionally, whenever i have spoken to musicians from whichever genre, this common love of “music” overrides smaller bags and styles.. it’s just one big-love-cake.. love-good-music.. love-good-photography.

    i’ve never met a musician who exerts to ‘challenge” a genre in which they hope to achieve..
    it sounds a bit wonky..
    a deep house musician saying they want to challenge the foundations of house?
    did aphex twin consciously want to evolve electronic music, or did he just do it?
    and on..
    surely, some do challenge and contradict – although i’ve yet to hear any mention of that as a lofty goal.. a pedestal-expounded virtue of ones own work..
    it’s a natural evolution, i think, and i tend to mistrust self-ascribed critical acclaim unless the work is very, very convincing..

    i see the comments under the first essay as fair on the whole.. at times it is possible for a good story idea to be photographed poorly.. or even over-embellished by text..
    that’s all i think..
    no need to postulate or argue, although i am guilty, and no need to fall out, though perhaps there too.. hmm..

    and so to my point..

    i dislike the pressure photographers seem to feel of placing themselves in a box.. exerting themselves as evolutionary.. extraordinary.
    i’m not sure any of the photographers nor musicians i respect – here on burn or elsewhere – have ever *said* as much.. they just are.

    john mcLaughlin didn’t earn a name-dedicated track on bitches-brew because he told miles davis he was “progressing jazz”.. he earn’t it because he did progress jazz.. just *did*.

    theory is important and comes with practice if not learn’t in the classroom.. referencing is a fun game too.. it adds confidence and authenticity to a work..
    yet isn’t execution and presentation paramount.. overriding.. ?

    none of us need to be told what a piece of work is doing if the work is actually *doing* it convincingly.

    chips for tea n bed for me.

  • david:

    well put….as always

    and from here on out, i will do no more referencing…nor extended commenting…drafting a letter to david this weekend….next time you hear from me in any extended matter it will be when work is out…my own…..the luft is gone…a shame…john’s admonition was enough….i may be prolix but i aint pumpkin-headed…

    long before we all knew one another, my focus was work (still is, though that seems to have been forgotten as we judge one another ridiculously though commentary) and so a return back to a quieter palace-place…

    i started with work, spent most of my time here trying to write about other’s work (my promise to david 3 years ago) and get snuffed by that….

    for now, will just leave congrats for the remaining finalists…

    so far, 2 terrific photographers and i’m thrilled/excited to see the rest….

    will speak with work from here on out….no more words but:….congrats

    said enough…it’s been a ride….


  • Michael Webster:

    how dare you write that nonsense about me under daria’s essay….

    “in Bob’s words, uncultured morons who don’t know their Gogol from a hole in the ground,”…..

    you, a writer, of all people…a ‘journalist’….

    Michael, i not only never said that, but never implied it….you who stormed Burn by referencing everything you’d read to the same extent as a way to ‘dialog’…u don’t remember you entrance?….

    you should be ashamed to even imply that I consider anyone here in such a degrading way….

    shame on you michael….

    this whole discussion has been reduced to a kindegarden….and my defense of this work was just that, a defense, not an an insult to others…



  • given the ‘tradition’ of your bus photography, i can only speculate that the kind of narrative that may define Daria’s work is too abstract for your sensibilities…

    Sometimes I’m a journalist, sometimes a satirist. If that quote’s not an invitation to satire, maybe I oughtta become a gardener. As long as the roots are not severed, all is well. And all will be well in the garden.


    Please someone make a bet with me!

    In the words of the drill instructor from “Stripes”… “Lighten up Francis”

    We all know that at least 10% (if not more) of things posted online are either poorly worded or just misunderstood.

  • David,Anton

    I do not like the white. And please, perhaps a bit larger font size for us older folks?

  • Paul…

    How went your evening yesterday? Webb’s book finally arrived.. no time though right now..

  • Ross..

    Thanks for the links!

  • I do not like the white. And please, perhaps a bit larger font size for us older folks?……………zoom text only on your computer

  • Sortra used to the white now,,,,,,,better white light than burning black smoke and there seems a bit of that around here

  • Bob B…

    I don’t think John Gladdy was attacking your work at all.
    I feel he was just trying to explain how one can try to sell an essay with glorious artist statements and referencing of influences but if it the actual images doesn’t work or convey photo/content wise… all is hopeless and lost.

  • Pete…

    The odds always favor the house!! :))))

  • Eva…

    Pep Bonet’s talk last night was one hell of a sobering and inspiring three hours! The man is absolutely totally implicated in his desire to portray the inhumanity many suffer. A very close and warm person who answered sincerely every question whilst showing different slide shows from his portfolio. He also showed us a very short clip from a documentary filmed in Africa which is in the making on how he works and that was quite impressive and very close up.

  • No Paul John and mw have had Bob in their sights for some time

  • Imants…

    What are the Burn rules on duels?
    First blood or last man standing… problem is, who’s sunrise do we choose :)))

  • No sunrises thus the perpetual motion nature of the games

  • YEE-HAA!!

    Postman just delivered Living Color!


    i can assure you that no photographer sells an essay to me with words….i personally disregard all artists statements when looking at work…i take a quick look for “caption info” just to see if the essay is about polar exploration or ash tray design, but it is about pictures pictures and pictures…

    i want to have text, either explanation or artist statement, to publish for the readers here, but it would be heresy for me personally to publish on the text as the reason for being…

    this does not mean of course that there will ever be a consensus on the pictures themselves…all of us have different tastes and backgrounds in the choice of one picture over another…it is totally a judgment…a subjective call..photographers do not “win” in the same way a track runner does….photographers are set up high, or rejected , in the same way a ice skater, ballet dancer, sculptor, painter, musician is judged…

    the irony is of course this..photographers set themselves up first…the first subjective call is the photographer subjective call….self proclaimed by just the nature of it…only one person decides if a photographer is in fact a photographer…and that is the photographer …no test…no jury..one just says one day “i am a photographer” ..

    this is the beauty of it, and oftentimes the ugliness of it as well…for anyone can just declare it..so that part, that self declaration, is way way way more subjective than the jury part…think about this …however, talented photographers will it seems one way or another over time rise…having been “juried” by many…the image of the unrecognized photographer living alone and lonely in a basement full of just brilliant work is an image for a film maker, but rarely if ever actually a fact…if there is such a person, please let me know!! i am ready to publish….

    again, for those feeling that they do not get what they deserve, there will always be a pool of bitterness and discontent….just look at the acid pools all over the photography internet world where anyone can write on the wall and anyone has the “word power” to strike down those who are being for the moment held high…yes, word power, rather than picture power…ahh the irony…yes?

    you rarely, if ever, will see a harsh critique from a photographer whose own visual work has significance…please read that sentence again….most truly talented photographers merely stay silent on work they do not appreciate….i mean really, what artist who is actually producing has the time to waste blasting someone that they do not hold in high regard?? not better to just go make some photographs?? whatever pictures you have to lay on the table so to speak is a photographer’s only retort…get a bunch of opinions if desired, and then go back to work for heavens sake..

    when i read i seriously harsh critique, or any critique actually , i always take a look at the website, the ‘from whence it came”…oftentimes revealing in itself..writing truly good critique, positive or negative. is an art unto itself…just as difficult as making an interesting photograph….few tennis players are actually bitter because they are not playing Wimbledon, they know where they stand…not so with so so many photographers …

    i do not know what the answer is here frankly…i really hate to see this…a serious lament….i try very hard to explain to photographers why their work may or may not make to a certain level…and of course always recommend they get more than one opinion…

    again, i am the very first to say i am only one opinion, this is only one website…for those who feel slighted or left out or just not recognized, i would say please please please go seek other points of view other places other venues..

    mostly i would say love doing what you do…if you have that , then you have the only vote you need…

    cheers, david

  • David…

    I’m not bitter over anything published on Burn. Absolutely the other way round, grateful, enjoying every second I read, learn and breathe photography with all the other Burnians. Knowing what a privilege it is to have a site like this and concious of the fact that Burn probably is a very big time/professional sacrifice for you and Anton. I’m certainly not bitter about the EPF at all, I’m the first one who realizes in my current situation/talent as a photographer without no question at all, I’ve no hope of making a mark or anything special which could be considered for the grant.
    Apart from the fact if I was bitter I would do what you David have repeatedly advised anyone who was critical or bitter about an essay…

    “Put your money where your mouth is.”

  • “one just says one day “i am a photographer”

    Hell, I never knew. Does this work with other stuff…. let’s see….



    Sorry Harvey, I just could not resist. But I get your point. Sort of.

  • Well if David, Daria and any Burnian feels my comment on Ivan and the moon essay was way to harsh a critique – I realize it’s the first time I haven’t liked an essay – I appologize I must concede I don’t usually delve in the negative side in life or opinions…
    So there we go,

    And perhaps I should put my money where my mouth is, after all I’ve got more free time than average person at least at the moment.

  • The three finalists are pretty interesting and diverse both in content and maturity and I guess that places commentators in a difficult position. Is it my bias that is driving the comment, am I fair or am I just a dickhead!!!
    I am happy to put my opinions here and as I have commentated on all three I guess you will be subject to another 7 comments by me. My take so far in a small nutshell…..

    no1 ……. needs an injection of greater and more diverse content but mixed with a day to day documentary style could be very interesting.

    no2 ……. mature and knows where it is going

    no3…….. stuff that I can live with and sits well within my realms of thinking

  • PAUL

    oh no…so sorry..i was not writing to you about anything YOU have ever said…i gotta go back and look and see why i wrote that letter to you , but trust me it was not about you at all…a general statement and i just keyed off of something you had written…


    you made my point…which i obviously must not have written clearly….of course you cannot just declare yourself a nuclear physicist ,but you CAN just declare yourself a photographer…no, you cannot get paid maybe, but you can declare it…and i am sure you of all people believe that some get way way out of synch with where they actually are on the playing field so to speak…but then again we do not all agree on the game being played…right? smiling..so sorry we missed here in D.C…i am here until noon if you are in town..if so ,let’s grab a coffee …text me…

    cheers, david

  • Well, I may have gone a bit overboard in my critique of those who critique the critiquers, but still… really nasty stuff thrown at Framer’s Intent under that essay, especially that quote I pulled from Bob.

    Ya know, she didn’t like the work and she did a pretty good job explaining why she didn’t like the work–certainly made a strong effort to explain it–and nothing in her critique could be remotely construed as a personal attack on the artist; yet she was personally attacked as jealous and bitter and lacking the intellect to appreciate abstraction (i.e. stupid).

    And ya know, even if someone is actually jealous and bitter and stupid, what’s that got to do with their critique? If the critique is stupid or somehow communicates jealousy and bitterness, it’s fair game to critique the critique. But to attack the person, personally? That’s just wrong.

    Of course there’s the question of purpose for comments under an essay. Is it a place to discuss photography or is it more of a virtual choir where anyone is invited to join, as long as they stay in tune and sing uplifting songs?

    Of course David, it’s your house, if you want it to be a house of worship, that’s certainly your prerogative. Personally though, I think it works better as a bawdy house and/or gin joint. And as you have noted before; nobody who’s anybody pays attention to the comments. The comment section is to burn’s photography what the circus sideshow is to Hollywood. It’s loud and it’s tacky and there’s freaks and the great majority disdain or ignore it, but a few like it and it has some kind of value. Then of course some of us just like talking about photography and don’t get so much opportunity out in real life.

  • Civiiiiiii….

    Where are you?
    I’m so used to turning on my mobile or laptop and seeing your wise words :))

  • Then too, we usually don’t know what the artist wants, if anything, from comments. I’m sure we all enjoy praise, and all of us are probably at least tempted to enjoy universal praise, but I know some genuinely appreciate, if not actually enjoy, negative criticism. As someone from the latter category, I genuinely appreciate honesty and different perspective and sometimes, though far from always, learn something from it. And when someone seems to be bitter or jealous or just plain mean, it doesn’t bother me much, I just feel a bit sorry for them. The only thing I really hate to see are personal attacks. I can handle them when directed at me, but am more likely to get angry when directed at someone else, more so when they’ve done nothing whatsoever to warrant them.

    But of course not everyone is the same and sometimes people project their own traits onto others. Again using myself as an example, since I’m not usually hurt by negative criticism I realize I can sometimes inadvertently be a bit callous towards others who are much more sensitive. That’s unfortunate and it certainly doesn’t make me feel good about myself when it happens. But personal foibles aside, at this late date in the internet age everyone should be aware that if they put their work out there, it just might receive some negative feedback.

  • Where is that quote mw?

  • This one?

    given the ‘tradition’ of your bus photography, i can only speculate that the kind of narrative that may define Daria’s work is too abstract for your sensibilities…

  • No this one ………. when you state in Bob’s words, “uncultured morons who don’t know their Gogol from a hole in the ground,” ??????

  • i want to jump in, but i gotta meet Pete M for coffee right now, and then drive 6 hours home to peace on the porch from our Federal Village the District of Columbia….back here Burn tonight or first thing in the morning….all good…

  • That’s just my translation of the quoted line and, loosely, other parts of the attack. It’s satire, parody. But you knew that, eh…

    In the garden, growth has it seasons. First comes spring and summer, but then we have fall and winter. And then we get spring and summer again.

  • No I didn’t know that and I did check what Bob wrote so that’s why I made the inquiry ….after all you did state that they were Bob’s words and you placed it in quotation marks. …… no it’s not satire nor is it parody, it just seems be something that you are proud of doing.

  • But to attack the person, personally? That’s just wrong………interesting comment mw seeing that you personally attacked Bob

  • Attacked bob’s comment, not bob. Projecting, much?

  • MW…

    My humble opinion tells me you owe Bob and apology.

  • Agree with Paul.. also about the fact that John was talking about work generally, not Bob’s work specifically.. at least that is how I understood it..

    Bob and Sara were having what seemed to become a quite interesting discussion over under the essay, not a fight, both grown up, both able to stand their ground, both with their own solid arguments, don’t really see the point in jumping in the middle of it..

  • To chip in, since this whole discussion revolves (loosely…) around the discussion I got into with Bob on Daria’s essay, I’m not really all that thin skinned, so I didn’t take any offence to what he wrote. I enjoy finding out how my thoughts are interpreted by others, be it thoughts I convey through my words or through my photographs, or through anything else. And I am new to photography, so I’m really enjoying the unique chance I have right now to be both passionate about the medium, know a fair bit of the history, yet also be an opinionated git occasionally knowing that by doing so openly I could stand to learn a lot from other people questioning my opinions. I relish challenges like Bob’s because they all, at some level, feed in to my growth, both as a photographer and as a lover of photography. I fail to see what I have to be scared of, other than annoying a few people (but I figure that is something that happens regardless of your stance or disposition). I know there’ll come a day when I can’t retract an opinion as easily as I currently can by hiding behind the “But, I’m new to this!” excuse. I referred to my newness in commenting on Daria’s essay as much to give Daria a heads up on where I was writing from, as I don’t like to claim a negative review as some kind of universal or objective indictment.

    The same way I’ll ask questions like I did a while back about transit work I should check out, I’ll also voice my opinion as strongly as I can to create the chance to find something new from the responses to it. If the responses cause me to reflect on my own work or thinking, I haven’t lost anything from the exchange. Dialogue isn’t a contest in the strict win-lose sense. And photography is never a strictly solitary activity.

    Bob raised some really fair and accurate points about my writing and thinking. Some of his other observations I do think were either wrong or poorly worded. But I’ve read his responses carefully and have decided which bits I feel hit home and which don’t – i.e. which bits I can therefore learn from and which I can’t. Job done.

    That post of yours above deserves to be bookmarked permanently.

  • really enjoying the frequency of work being shown on burn.. keeps a momentum and rhythm going..

  • a civilian-mass audience

    PAUL…Estamos Aqui…myBURNIANS,
    I am sleeping on the streets…with my greek people…we WOKE UP,thank you SPAIN!!!

    “To effectively communicate, we must realize that we are all different in the way we perceive the world and use this understanding as a guide to our communication with others.”
    Anthony Robbins

    “Two men in a burning house must not stop to argue”
    African proverb
    Keep BURNING…

  • a civilian-mass audience

    I am out …BUT I have not abandonded our BURNING ship
    NOBODY leaves the deck…
    part of the ship
    part of the crew…I have not signed any permission slips…
    be United…I need you My BURNIANS,each and everyone of you…

    “To be one, to be united is a great thing. But to respect the right to be different is maybe even greater.”

    P.S no time to check all of your comments and essays BUT when I will be back I want you all here…
    with ouzo and wine…I need your support

    NOBODY leaves the ship…BOBBY,MW,JOHNYG…SPACECOWBOY,SIMONE,ELI…Respect,give a hug ,damnit…

    I would love a public hug …or I will sent some smelly silents…YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED

  • the best / toughest / most valued critics i’ve had have been my editors and also strangers when i’ve secretly moderated my own exhibitions

  • BOB

    when i said
    “none of us need to be told what a piece of work is doing if the work is actually *doing* it convincingly.”
    i intended it towards the artists talking about their own work – and not your highly accomplished appraisals of work, which i enjoy very much..

    the two are different things, your writing as an appreciation of work and an artist writing about their own work.. it’s the later i sometimes find lofty and irksome, in which case i would rather not read..

    i fear a misunderstanding now..

  • .. and.. reading back.. there is an urge now to write a defensive statement outlining my lack of bitterness and cynicism.. how mid-career satisfaction and the “what next” is most definitely ON..
    .. yet, i’ll make a cup o tea instead.


  • Is there any well known/respected photographer who works in broad midday light or has created a series of images/essay?

  • Ross…

    Thanks for the Eggleston link :)

  • Paul,
    Check out some of the portfolios here:


    “Yangtse. The Long River” is midday light such that it is considering the smog,haze,etc


  • Thanks Mark!
    Most afternoons I’m occupied watching kids and I have no time to take advantage of the lovely late evening Mediterranean light. However on the other hand I’ve loads of time when the light is harsh so I was wondering if that light can be successfully harnessed/tamed :)

  • Shooting in harsh, midday light might not be ideal, true… but it can be done. And done well!

  • Michael…

    Yes it won’t be the best light but it’s better than sitting at home wasting time! :))
    So thanks again Mark and Michael.

  • @ ROSS: Cricket? no thanks…

    Speaking about sports and photography… I’m following a group of guys that play POLO but not with horses, with bicycles! So, this weekend, is the annual championship in southern France. A very rookie championship, few teams, but, but getting bigger every month. Level is raising!
    In a few years I suppose big sponsors will be on the “move”.
    Last year I was there, below some images:


    If you have few minutes to look at, critics are accepted (constructive ones) to improve my body of work.

    Patricio, shooting :-D

  • Patricio…

    I’m not seeing pics at that link.

  • Hi Patricio,

    I shot some bike polo and bike messengers for a feature a few years bike. Fun stuff…

    My advice would be to try and find more candid moments… expressions esp that are genuine, unique, and not done for the camera or aware of the camera. Also really bring home that intensity when the ball breaks free and the riders rush after it. Get down low and shoot up – if you are at the same or below level of the bikes it will bring more intimacy. Maybe use a flash. Maybe see if you can get them to play a fake match with you in the middle.

    best if luck, it’s a great subject (one I actually considered for a project) and you have a good start.


  • http://www.blurb.com/mobile/show/012b3146f

    new Blurb app…click link above to see the
    “Lola The Black Queen”

  • Dude! I’m still laughing!

    “You gotta poop!”

  • Paul, I hope you don’t take this the wrong way. Sometimes people have such radically different outlooks that it’s just difficult to communicate without resulting in unintentional slights and misunderstandings. So I don’t mean to criticize here, just to question why.

    I did a project a few years ago that required extensive shooting under an intense midday summer sun. This was before I was involved with burn, but I don’t think it would have made any difference. Point is, it never occurred to me to question how anyone else had handled that particular challenge. I just went out and figured it out. And on reflection, I think that’s a big part of what I love about being a photographer–the figuring out part. Every project, every scene, requires some figuring out how to handle its unique challenges. I’m only interested in how others have met similar challenges after I’ve come up with my own solutions. Of course my solutions may be of the Ed Wood variety, but I can live with that possibility. I’d rather be uniquely terrible than conventionally good. Of course uniquely good is more the goal… Anyway, my humble advice is to put down the books and figure it out for yourself. I suspect you’d find it much more rewarding that way.

    Regarding the personal attacks, yea, that’s one of my pet peeves and I would have been better off just saying “what’s up with that ugly personal attack, bob,” rather than letting it ferment for a few days and going all literary on his ass (just let the phrase “their Gogol from a hole in the ground” resonate around in your head for awhile), but nevertheless it was not a personal attack, more akin to literary criticism. And it wasn’t just bob. I was particularly dismayed that it was charles that started in with the tired, sick jealousy trope. Seriously people, that shit’s just plain ugly and, I like to think, beneath you.

    Day to day, I forget that many people can’t tell the difference between an intellectual critique and a personal attack because it’s really not all that difficult. Criticizing a work or an idea is one thing. Criticizing a person is something entirely different. There’s nothing necessarily wrong with the former (though how it’s done can certainly be an issue), butthe latter is seriously uncool in just about any circumstance. For example, “your work sucks” is okay, though one should really provide some reasons why; but “you suck” is not. Cause the problem with personal attacks is that they are nearly impossible to defend. Answering them makes one sound all defensive and guilty: “Nuh uh, I don’t suck;” and ignoring them is painful and seen by the peanut gallery as an admission. And unfortunately, these kinds of personal attacks are too often used simply to squelch speech. How many times will Framer’s Intent tell us what she really thinks when she’s constantly accused of being shallow, bitter, and jealous? Well, maybe she can handle it, but for every one who can stand up to it, how many anonymous folk just keep their mouth shut or sing half-heartedly with the choir?

  • David: well said!
    And of course you know my feelings on Burn :) I’m happy it and you are here.

    The most unfortunate part of life is that, so many can just claim one day that they’re a photographer and the next, their not. I HATE hearing someone who has asked me what I do, and after I tell them I’m a photographer, they 99.9% time ask Do you have a studio? Do you do weddings? My reply has been recently: No I don’t plan to have a studio / I don’t do weddings, but I charge a lot.
    Around here, where I live, no one seems to understand what photography is. They think it’s an illustration only and something to have done on your wedding day. It is so much more than an illustration, A photograph is an idea, a vision, a way of seeing, and a way of talking. It is love, a poem, a song, a performance, and for someone who truly understands, it’s a way of life.

    ALL –
    If anyone is in the San Francisco area June 18-20 I will be there visiting a friend and seeing where he works. If anyone is up for a short visit, I’ll be in the area!

  • MW:

    this will be quick, as i have promised anton and david that i will continue to write, but in a very different vain. just to remind you, i simply want to know how in the world did anything that i write under daria’s essay constitute a personal attack against you or anyone else. Sara and I were having a discussion/dialog/debate (and btw, we’ve chatted privately). i hadn’t even noticed you’d commented under the essay until last night. my dialogue was about some questioning if he essay was good enough to be considered for the grant (a very unfortunate remark, and one that questioned not only daria but david/anton) and also trying to contextualize why I liked the essay and felt why it was strong/interesting. i had no anger at all until John made those comments about me and then your comment last night. please tell me what i wrote was at all about you, or demeaning. I can certainly see how others would construe my dialog with Framers as heated (that’s the problem with web) and i was disapppointed by much of the negative criticism, not because it was negative (to each their own) but the language used against it…and then when i tried to write/defend it, i get label as some guy handolding an art snow angel….and last night was really unfortunate…anyway…it’s enough and over….clearly we’re different folk…and i’m not interested in this anymore…and it doesn’t matter…

    i’m here for 1 reason: to support BURN and david and anton and all the great photographers that are published and all the people in love with picture taking….i’m not here to resolve world conflict or write the bible on what is/isn’t good photography….

    i did overreact (it’s my emotional nature)….

    but, going further, i will not ‘fight’ or ‘debate’ anyone here, it is not worth it…i will simply write about the photographers…let others challenge/battle it out….but as a writer michael, if you cannot tell the difference between ‘literary critism’ and a belittling, acid bite, well, i’d be surprised..

    good luck michael….

    john g: i apologize for my angry comment to you. you do get the ‘best’ of me going ;))….but i hope by you do realize that i write here not to kiss ass or hold hands but to do what i do other than be a photographer: write…and in this case, try to write about photography….

    as an hall-of-fame member of the ‘i wont write anymore’/’i’mmmmm back’ (pschotic music in the background) asylum, i’ll just say that i will let keep my long referenced-addled work to photography and not to other’s ideas….

    until the next finalist…

  • “zoom text only on your computer”

    Thanks Imants, (as I slap myself upside the head)

  • Gordon yes , click (ctrl +)

  • Michael our translation was not literary criticism just plain slander……

  • Alright, I suppose I should defend myself as far as my comment about negative comments under Daria’s essay but you know what…fuck that shit. DAH backed me up for what I saw not as critique but as yet more snide comments cloaked as criticism from those who should know better. I’ll be the first to offer a critique if I feel I can add something potentially helpful, but you know what, if I just don’t plain ol’ like the work I’ll keep my mouth shut and get on with my own shit. And I know that if I was to name names, then I would be shit rained on, because typically those who dole it out the most are the least able to take it in return. So I’ll leave it at my original “some.”

    A story: a couple of years back I went into the neighborhood cafe where I had become a friend of the owner. There were new paintings on the wall, and they were awful, in my opinion. He was standing there talking to someone I didn’t know, and I was about to make a snide comment on the art. Something held me back – first off he must think something of it to have it on his walls. And then he introduced me to the person he was talking to – who was the painter. So not only would a snide remark have upset my friend, as well as the painter, but it would have made me look like a total shit. And it would have all been merely to stroke my ego, to make myself look better smarter, funnier at somebody else’s expense.

    Working with students, I’ve found some that can talk a mean streak, have the passion, the words down, but alas will never be able to competently work a camera and compose a decent shot to save their lives. And then there are others, who seem to be alone in there shell, can barely hear when they tell me their name, that step up and burn with the camera in their hand.

    Anyway, lets all try and bury the hatchet, step up with some positivity, and not let this place devolve into yet another internet forum bitter jaded freak show.

    Okay, lets keep the freak part….:)


  • ……..the old no no I am not attacking the person I am just beating the shit out of his kneecap

  • That’s the sum of your game Michael as you bury Charles’s hatchet into another knee …………..

  • Please please Charles can I be one of the some…………

  • Umm charles, that’s all great, but weren’t you the one that started with the negative shit in the other thread? You were definitely near the top. The accusations of jealousy? Don’t get angry, shoot the messenger, better to take a deep breath. Take ten. Then ask yourself what was up with that comment? Why did you make that kind of personal attack?

    And bob, if you want to explain that quote, please do. Typing too fast? I could accept that, but it’s been out there for a few days and you seem to be standing by it. Explain why that isn’t a legitimate target for satire. More likely, if my translation wasn’t spot on, it wouldn’t have bothered anyone so much.

    Seriously, you all are decent people. Why not renounce these personal attacks? Just because someone disagrees with you, or the choir, on a photo essay doesn’t mean they’re petty and/or shallow. N’est pas?

  • And charles, to be honest, a negative comment from you would be worth more to me than all the hallelujahs from the sweetest sounding choir. Though I grant, as per your example, there’s a time and a place…

    And bob, last note, I know charles wasn’t talking about you in his aspersions about those who can dish it out and not take it, but you know you’ve severely criticized my writing on several more than one occasion. I appreciated it, figured you meant well… Might not have agreed but went back and considered your points with an open mind.

  • Let’s move on. Too much good stuff to see,
    cogitate, absorb. Bob, MW shake hands and
    come back to the conversation.

  • “Umm charles, that’s all great, but weren’t you the one that started with the negative shit in the other thread? You were definitely near the top. “………. see that’s not a personal attack by mw is it? No it is just explaining that his attitude as a person is not up to scratch. Maybe he will rephrase it to suit his argument further down the track

  • Now I’m confused.

    *goes back to making photographs*

  • whew… too much testosterone in here… i guess that’s good
    but i miss the gardenias and andrew b’s popcorn and diet coke,
    tor capa and pistachio ice cream and katie-cakes’ lounge couch.

    i wish i was a photographer so i can understand what you all are saying.

  • …….that mw calls literary criticism or in his case literary genius

  • Gordon yes , click (ctrl +)

    Thanks Panos, that was way too easy.

  • you are very welcome Gordon…

  • http://www.zougla.gr/page.ashx?pid=2&aid=308450&cid=4

    ALL..I KNOW most cant read greek but it doesnt matter..plz click link above and u will see photos and videos of what is going on in greece right now ..:(…
    i dont know how to help with a camera but i will try to purchase an air ticket and make it there in couple of months i hope…pain, police brutality…and ..and…(i have no words)

  • please click on the 2nd and 3rd video…the protester is a “vegetable” as for now…thank you POLICE! thank you IMF…:(

  • In English (though not nearly as powerful as the images Panos linked to) – http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/may/11/greece-doomed-generation

  • Okay, I’m tired. I was in NYC, on a shoot when I wrote under Daria’s piece, now back and it’s my day with Felix, a full time job (which I do love). I actually thought twice about that jealousy bit and should have cut it and then well, as you know, the submit click happens and that’s that. But really, it sometimes comes off as that – though I guess it’s really just the ego talking (which if I had said big ego instead would probably be just as beaten up). And maybe it was just about my ego when I hated on the haters…. isn’t it all ego? In the words of the Beastie Boys…”Check your head….”

    I do think a modicum of respect is due, both to DAH and his panel of experienced judges for their choices and to the photographer her/himself. Being derided for having achieved a certain level or type of education is neither nice nor clever.

    Anyway, lets move forward, remember that it’s ALL personal (how can it not not be???), and be diligent with our words thusly.

    And remember a negative comment from Jim P. most likely means you’re doing just fine….:)

  • Charles have you considered my some proposal?

  • Charles , ALL, the new BEASTIE BOYS album is amazing btw..

    Framers I., thank you for the link…

  • Charles, i dont know if u noticed , but i enjoyed the movie DOCU “HYPE”….loved your insight..and the whole docu…im a Nirvana child after all..

  • Bit of a don’t blame us article in the guardian ……

  • its half truth… DONT BLAME US AT ALL , IS also an understatement..

  • mw…

    I don’t take things badly quite the opposite so no worries or misunderstandings :)…
    I’ll try my best to quickly explain my reasons for searching for examples on harsh light…
    I spend most of the day on 2 crutches, i walk my kids back and forth to school 6 times, I cook their lunch and usually we go to the local park together in the afternoons. Just the school is a little over a 1 km away… I don’t want to waste energy getting on a bus and moving round the city on crutches if it isn’t worth it. I’m all for experimenting but I just can’t physically manage it. BTW I’m bit like the proverbial English shit house, I’m not at all weak physically but legs will always be better than crutches :)! I just want to get out screw worries and produce images and thanks to Mark and Michael I feel a lot more hopeful.
    As far as text books I stopped using them when I finished my degree in photography about 8 years ago, yes I have studied photography seriously it’s just that many a time I refrain from giving opinions – one thing is the theory they teach you and another is the real deal out there. You see the only defect I find with dialogue on Burn is my own limitations as a writer. Reading Bobs, Jeffs, your’s, David’s, Akaky’s and many others comments make me feel a very inadequate writer – don’t want to forget David B or my latest discovery – Framers Intent wow you’re one hell of a good writer! – so I like to keep a low profile opinion wise – it’s so easy to be misunderstood. However if we ever manage to chat on Skype and that goes for anyone else round here, you’ll find me a hell of a much more eloquent person when talking and a cheecky sense of humour included.
    Obviously Charles saw/read something in comments generally which irritated him, that’s OK, he doesn’t usually critizice others round here and I think you’re all correct on this subject, only thing is Michael it’s not fair to make up quotes – all your other points are totally valid as are Charles.

  • so, Paul…am i not a good writer????
    i will try to write in greek from now on:(
    big hug bro!

  • Panos better to be a good typer than a good writer when using a computer to communicate

  • now…that was funny…time for me to lighten up!:)))))

  • Panos…

    My friend we must Skype soon, once you finish that postcard trip, I’ve got that new webcam sitting waiting, never used it yet.
    I hope you haven’t felt ofended by my words and that goes out to anyone else – sorry.
    But Panos tell me who else here on Burn or what the hell Magnum captures in images his/her life as intensely and truthfully as you do. You don’t need words you’ve got an eye that is free of all doubts. Frida would be proud of her Greek student…you are the modern Henri Latigue with that extra bit of bite…

  • Skype soon….sure sure….
    offended? by what? nahhh those days are over!
    Frida’s student …?????? now thats a “blasphemy” that i really really like..
    gracias amigo

  • a civilian-mass audience

    I am reporting from the streets of Greece…we are going down BUT the spirit is up…

    I am holding a poster …VIVA BURN,revolution Now!!!
    you might see me in your screens…

    no time to read,I hope you are all ok…Be you,Be United,RESPECT…

    I LOVE YOU ALLLLL…and THANK YOU for all your support
    cause whatever you do
    it comes back to YOU


  • a civilian-mass audience

    PANOS…come back with camera…I need a photographer to “TELL IT LIKE IT IS”

    THODORIS…are you in AThens?

  • Civi..i hear u…
    its just a luxury for us here in the US/Australia etc…in all those isolated islands living the “dream”…swimming in our “fake safety”…
    Even here in Burn, we are “fighting”, debating, intellectualizing, bullshiting….while the REAL compassionate “fighters” (see Tim Hetherington)giving their life , because they try to “connect” and “understand” what the f$$k is going on…I do feel guilty when i can get a T-bone steak and a tequila for $7 in “happy hour” while my brothers in Greece, Italy, Spain, Ireland, Egypt, Libya and on and on fighting for their independence…
    The ignorants last year used to accuse greece for corruption but now (too late) they realized that it wasnt the P.I.G.S that were overspending…no , no…It was the wall street mafia and the Holy Christian european North that was OVERCHARGING…But cleverly enough the forced the south to new austerity utopic measures and WORST , THEY INSTILLED GUILT into those countries..so to numb their citizens so they wont revolt…
    but history proves that in times like this there is always a GHANDI or a CHE or even a Jesus that is born…justice will come…not soon…blood blood blood first…
    Ahhhh the masters of war..bobby dylan was right..those masters of WAR are here..
    (and we still debating if a nikon is better than a canon)…
    Shame on all of us….

  • now question to all:” which camera can record the red color better? i mean BLOOD/RED?????

  • I do think a modicum of respect is due, both to DAH and his panel of experienced judges for their choices and to the photographer her/himself. Being derided for having achieved a certain level or type of education is neither nice nor clever.

    Anyway, lets move forward, remember that it’s ALL personal (how can it not not be???), and be diligent with our words thusly.

    Yup, well said.

  • MW…

    I hope my words didn’t sound too ungrateful as I always appreciate your thoughts. Yesterday was a strange day on Burn, well actually for me it isn’t yesterday it’s still today I haven’t gone to bed yet and no time to sleep till late to night! :))

  • Charles…
    ”Check your head….”

    Yes but I’m going to fight for my right to party!! :)))))))))

  • Civi… no I’m in Nicosia

  • a civilian-mass audience


    BURN BABY BURN…dance with me MyTrueFriends…!!!


    What not to BURN…!!! I am holding the BURN poster …outside on the street…
    people believe I lost it…
    they don’t know…I just found me

    BURN baby BURN…big hug from your silent MASS audience

  • a civilian-mass audience

    GO THODORIS…keep working…I will be out on the streets…

    as long as my feet…can hold me…


  • everybody please relax…all is just fine…a spirited discussion is ok and i am never offended one way or another by whatever is said here…i mean if one of you threw a tomato at one of my prints hanging in an exhibit, i might take a bit of offense since mike probably stayed up all night printing it, but other than that what i see here is an open blog/forum…

    hell, maybe even the tomato stained print might pick up value!!

    if and when anyone here goes completely off the rails of decorum, then it seems pretty obvious to one and all and that person then seems to be standing naked in front of all….at that point, they then may even deserve some sort of group sympathy i suppose, and their hangover might be punishment enough..hug, hug

    if i make a counterpoint, it is for the sake of discussion and not because i have some sort of twisted dogmatic vision of what should be said and what not..i now invoke the “bigger fish to fry” slang as being logically appropriate….

    those of you who do know me in person well know that 99% of the time i am speaking with a twinkle in my eye…do i get upset or angry? yes of course i do …but NOT at comments on a blog..just please please do not let the air out of my tires…hmmm, well on the other hand, that might keep me from burning up this $5.a gallon gas which has just hit my neighborhood…

    ok, going for a bike ride….and oh , please no water balloons..i usually have my GF1 hanging around my neck and one of its weaknesses is that it is not so good in the wet…

    cheers, david

  • “burning up this $5.a gallon gas which has just hit my neighborhood…”

    Was $2.13 per litre here in NZ last week! ;-)

  • Ross…

    Just finished reading that interview you linked to William Eggleston. Never knew the man was colour blind!!

  • @ CHARLES: Thanks for the tips. Yes, this time I will use flash and record some sound with short interviews. Stay tuned for the result in a couple of days

    PS: Micheal, don’t know why you can’t see the link. Sometimes it happens in Macs…

  • *Framers quietly unpacks the tomatoes from the suitcase*

    *and the water balloons*

    *and the tire puncturing implement*

    *looks around to see if she has been spotted*

    Guys, this is a totally (maybe) theoretical question and all, but…

    Say you had been thinking of saving for a Panasonic GF1 or GF2. Say you wanted it in black. Say you were thinking also of getting the viewfinder for it and a pancake lens to go with the zoom. Say you also had little money and thus this vague plan was really fairly vague.

    Say you then received an Olympus Pen 2 with the kit lens (zoom). No viewfinder. And it is silver.

    Would you seriously consider selling this completely new boxed up camera for money to fund the Panasonic instead?

    Even if you were a few weeks away from shooting the start of project where it might prove useful. And you definitely wouldn’t be able to replace it with the Panasonic in time.

    I’m being a total cad here. I’ve won an Olympus Pen and I should be happy. But I’m going “it’s silver. And it’s dinky.” instead. I mean, it is silver. Not real silver mind (then I could afford to replace it with the Pano), but silvery coloured. Like I’d be going out with a giant mirror slung around my neck. Even when my SLR is in my bag.

    Or do I tape the bugger up, use it and enjoy? There’s no viewfinder. It feels proper weird.

    I’m sure I’ll get used to it. Or really hate it.

  • CIVI – hold your head up, wish I could walk alongside you. One day, my friend, one day. Keep posting, keep letting us know you’re safe.

  • Really interesting (I think) little debate on what being a photographer is over here – http://one125.net/post/5873400236/the-1978-test

  • Sorted.

    I’ll save for the Panasonic pancake lens to go on the Pen. Use the Pen. Maybe get a Panasonic (in black, black I say, black black black). Maybe then keep the Pen or maybe gift it to family member/friend of choosing. All “maybe” statements dependent upon the future, how the camera performs, and my general inclination at any given moment in time.

    So, everything is about as certain as can be hoped for, I guess. And I’m starting to feel a little bit Douglas Adams with all this modal talk.

    PAUL – blushes, thanks. Any gift that I might have flows from an inability to feel shame. ;-)

  • (then I could afford to replace it with the Pano),
    Framers? why thinking replacing me????????????
    olympus is fine…more than fine!
    ok, morning ALL…
    going for a bike ride also…nothing around my neck except my Frida Kahlo necklace for inspiration rather protection and the phone…it can shoot plus the “bike mate app”( free)..its awesome

    i have played with all of the “small” choices..the Fuji fx100 , the Olympus and the GF1….all are good for sure…and it depends on which features you feel you need most…i have only used the GF1 in day in and day out serious magazine assignment shooting conditions, and i did love it in the morning…the other two seem slow to me in comparison…not that i shoot so so fast, but i like to be able to shoot fast…GF1 winner hands down in fast autofocus no delay shooting..probably files best in the fx 100 i hear, but do not know for sure…for natgeo magazine size, the GF1 is perfect..i also made some large prints, 30×40 from the GF1 and just fine….many of my colleagues at Magnum sold on the Olympus which i have only played with, not used in the real world…i am sure you are fine with the Olympus..

  • btw… i just learned something NEW about my “beloved” China

    “China used prisoners in lucrative internet gaming work
    Labour camp detainees endure hard labour by day, online ‘gold farming’ by night”

    The 54-year-old, a former prison guard who was jailed for three years in 2004 for “illegally petitioning” the central government about corruption in his hometown, reckons the operation was even more lucrative than the physical labour that prisoners were also forced to do.

    “Prison bosses made more money forcing inmates to play games than they do forcing people to do manual labour,” Liu told the Guardian. “There were 300 prisoners forced to play games. We worked 12-hour shifts in the camp. I heard them say they could earn 5,000-6,000rmb [£470-570] a day. We didn’t see any of the money. The computers were never turned off.”


  • No, no, no, replace something else with you, Panos. Making you the upgrade. ;-)

    Just took it for a walk around the corner. Images were garbage, but the camera is actually fun and good to use. Gimme some time with this. But a pancake lens is a must. A viewfinder would also be useful – daylight and that screen aren’t the greatest of combinations.

    Bloody hell, I now have three cameras (Nikon dSLR, Oly OM2 mmm film grrr, and the Oly EPL-2). I’m like, a gear head, almost. How many more before I’m not allowed to utter the phrase “All the gear and no idea” without looking down and blushing heavily again?

    But, I got this camera for one of my pictures. So, all mock anguish aside, I am minorly proud. It’s like being one step away from having earned it. :-)

    *goes back to making pictures*

  • DAH
    Just saw your comments, thanks for the low down on them all. Think I’ll deffo stick with this, add a Panasonic pancake lens, and just keep my options open on the GF1 in case opportunity and means converge. ;-)

    Though, to be honest, nothing is comparing to the bizarre delight of shooting with the OM2 right now – that feeling of not knowing what you’ve got all day is amazing. Really focusses me. I try not to look at the screen with my digital cameras, but if I’m shooting for a project, the temptation is always there…


    oh yes…the OM2 is hard to beat..and yes with digi it takes an extra discipline not to look…as i have always noted with the film/digi conundrum , with film you MUST keep going forward forward forward and with digi it is easy to keep stepping back and looking when you should be moving ahead..too easy for instant gratification, but not necessarily really anything very good…looks so good on the screen..very very deceptive…with film, not knowing makes you hungry…and hungry is the best state of mind for everything…

  • No, no, no, replace something else with you, Panos. Making you the upgrade. ;-)
    phewww!..i read it wrong..sorry….by bad!:)))))))))))
    biggest hug!

  • …and hungry is the best state of mind for everything…
    smiling…go tell that in Greece…;)
    love u bro..
    ok , off for a ride! fo real now! no bull!

  • Framers Intent…

    Just remember you’re doing very well with your Nikon I do watch your blog quite often, don’t lose that magic you’ve got by worrying too much with the cameras. It’s so very easy to fall into that trap…


    Best to go out and try the Oly for a bit before commiting to a project with it. I had a GF1 w/20mm lens and just couldn’t get on with it. But others do (like DAH of course) so each to his own (I also can’t take an iphone pic worth a salt but then look at the work of Mike Brown). But Paul is right above – don’t discount what might already be working for you.

    Maybe sell the Oly and get a new lens for the Nikon if you don’t jibe with it….




    yes, Paul and Charles right..forget cameras , think about how you will tell your stories…and think about stories that have visual power…for example, if i may be so bold,if i were you i would get the roller derby work off your site..does you no good..one day of shooting and no apparent editing..your name and link are here and dozens of well known picture editors are lurking here on Burn…you want to make a good first impression…cut it all down tight..for your own good….anyway, let’s skype as soon as possible…i know what you want to do, and think i can set you in a direction that will feel good and yield some real work…up for it?

    cheers, david

  • Framers Intent…

    Make up your mind RIGHT NOW what camera are you going to use. Decide and forget what you would love to have or what you shouldn’t of sold but you did. Choose and live with that camera and if possible burn all zooms like some Viking funeral and if you can, use one fixed lens and just get used to the way that lens sees. Make your photography mentally automatic by hanging that camera round your neck all day and maybe all night and if not beside your bed when asleep in other word second nature. Be photography. Make sure your partner/s realize your life will always from now on consist of a trio, that camera will be like a hunch to Quasimodo. Shoot everything when not working on your essay/project to keep “fit”, tell that inner critic to fuck off and hope he or she dies on a freak yachting accident…
    And BURN!! I said BURN the living daylights out of your memory cards or film from so much inner desire/need to create…

  • eduardo sepulveda

    c’mon, flames are burning even up to Tierra del Fuego!!

    abrazos a todos!

  • mw:

    without anger…just to answer your questions and let’s move on…1) i didn’t see you’d written anything under daria until i saw the comment on May 25, 2011 at 6:16 pm . i wrote 2 hrs later. i responded to you when you’d bascially suggested (ok, satirically implied) that i was basically calling people who didn’t like the essay (or knew their gogol) morons (your words)…u do this OFTEN…you ‘joke’ with what appear to be angry and aggressive words (reminder before with david?) and then later apologize and retreat and say ‘it was joke/satire/writing’ etc…honestly, let’s just be honest and move on. I’m a ridiculously overly-sensitive guy who invests too much emotional energy on what people i don’t know/.haven’t met say here…my stupidity and also when i write, when i ‘argue’ on line it comes across as arrogant, patronizing and know-it-all arrogance. no doubt. i’m nothing like that in real life…except the supportive and emotional part. i’m loyal and i get overly worked up when i defend someone (father/teacher/oldest child in me)…and yes, i sometimes know when you are joking and sometimes, honestly michael, i do not. fair to see, i’m a good reader?…if not, i’m not the only one. again, i was in the middle of a ‘discussion’ with Sara (framers)…and had not clue you had one opinion or another…and i NEVER attacked anyone…but ok, this is silly….i’m also not critizied you as a writer, but for being a writer and failing to understand how it could be construed…the old tarry tarry, i didn’t mean to thrust….anyway….this is silly….and who cares…it’s past, over….bigger fish to fry….as for Charles comment, when i don’t think he was referring to me…;)))….about dishing it out/not taking it, etc…like i said, it’s over…i frankly don’t care anymore about what you think/like about me, and i hope to god’s sake, you don’t care about what i think…it’s just silly internet….who cares….i did learn 2 things…i will not ‘argue’ anymore here, and definitely not under the EPF…because we should all be celebrating the finalists….maybe that is what pissed me off…how could anyone be negative under these circumstances…you don’t like something, say it (or not) …but honestly, i’m here (as i imagine you are) for the work….and i do read what you write (and write well) with attention…and do reflect …and when the ‘satire’ comes out, sometimes it is genuinely funny and insightful and sometimes it is quite childishly ironic and pedantic…and the same is TRUE about when i write: pedantic, attention-seeking, prolix and over-heated….stupid really…both of us, frankly….we both behaved like asses, frankly….i for one won’t anymore….

    too much life to live and too much great stuff here to behave like that….

    instead, will just try to write the long-winded stuff for the work, and leave the other stuff (bickering/irony/arguing) for others who want…

    this EPF is fantastic…and all 3 have produced brilliant, thoughtful, provocative work…and that is what we should concentrate on…DAVID, ANTON AND THE EPF FINALISTS…

    the rest is just stupid, internet dross…

    let’s get back to the EPF guys…..

    whiskey on me if we ever meet…(no satire intended)

    to quote panos:

    peace :)

  • burning*michelle


    what is wrong with you?

    Jim Powers re: Zhe Chen Bees:
    “The psychotic photographing the psychotic. Why would this even be considered for the EPF award? It seems antithetical to the concept. What is this photographer emerging toward? Baffling, Harvey.”

    how dare you personally attack zhe chen? criticize the work, criticize the story, criticize burn all you want – i’m a proponent of free speech – but this type of remark is actually an assault on someone’s personality and character.

    an emerging photographer by any definition, she is an artist working to heal herself through the power of her visual voice. how dare you try and silence that with your abusive cruelty? because thats what it is – abusive – this is bullying behavior and you have crossed a line and gone far, far, far beyond the bounds of your usual negativity and cynicism.

    where is your humanity?

  • Bob, first, of course I care what you think; second, as I have mentioned, I think very well of you. I just didn’t like what you said in this particular instance. And it wasn’t just you, but other prominent burnians as well. You all hit a couple of my hot buttons. One, I really hate personal attacks. Two, I have a problem with a bunch of old guys ganging up on a young woman, at least when I feel she hasn’t done anything wrong (and yes, I know, FI doesn’t need any help here, still…) Too much resonance with a larger, far more ugly, facet of human nature, or at least modern society.

    And I don’t equate satire with joking. In the past there have been times when I was joking and it wasn’t perceived that way, but in this case I wasn’t joking and I haven’t apologized. I sincerely feel that what you guys did was wrong. But in hindsight it would have been much better had I addressed it earlier and more politely rather than seething for a few days and then going all caustic, but I’m not seeing where I’m wrong in the base analysis. People who made honest, impersonal criticisms of the essay in question were met with baseless, imo, personal attacks. And yes, I am aware that I am not pure in these matters… lordy knows I want to be… it’s difficult…

    About the EPF, I think a big part of my problem is I don’t see these essays as different than any others on Burn. It’s great that someone wins a lot of money (I’ve made it a point to contribute to that) and it’s great that however many finalists get some important recognition, but I look at them just as anything else published here. I guess so many egos are on the line that we should either join the choir or shut up, and I can understand that intellectually, but emotionally, it’s difficult cause as we all seem to agree, internet comments don’t matter much at all. Being published, or being an EPF finalist, is all that matters. Who cares what a bunch of internet bozos think?

    Anyway, a quote from Geldof:

    “Hey Bob, he said don’t get annoyed
    We all find different ways
    To fill up the void…”

    Peace accepted. Onward…

  • MW…

    well, you are probably not wrong about that..many of the finalists past and present were/are in fact essays that ARE published here…we try to publish very nice essays all the time..the ten finalists are from the same talent pool that we do publish regularly..always has been thus…so, exactly where do you think the finalists should come from? a whole different bunch of photographers? that would not make sense..you mean you think photographers might hide out and only decide to show up for EPF time? some surely with new work (you for example)..but most not…we had about 1000 entries, some of which had been published here and some we had never seen…800 went away immediately and 200 were left..that came down to 30 or so and then to 10….if you are disappointed , try thinking that maybe that reflects the state of photography today, the way it is, and not some narrow minded philosophy at Burn…we choose way way more widely than any other grant…most have a mission…we just want to celebrate all kinds of work….that’s it…that really IS it….

    what choir are you supposed to join or do you feel have been asked to join? your little riff here was with Bob, not anyone on the Burn staff…Bob is a terrific support here and is a long time fixture for text and photography and an honest sensitivity…Bob is who he is..he ain’t faking it……his real personality is to exude enthusiasm and positive energy…nobody thinks we need another Bob, but we certainly have here in comments a mix of the more cynical view and nobody intends to delete them…but are we not all free to comment back without it supposedly being some kind of forced march? …we at Burn would appreciate for the sake of readers here, reasonably intelligent comments, but we are not asking for and would deplore any kind of “choir”..yuk….why would we do that? think about it..you think you are the only revolutionary in the room? c’mon give a few others at least some credit for understanding what is up…many thanks

    cheers, david

  • Umm David, that was only a criticism of myself and my way of sometimes superficially looking at things. I have no complaints about the EPF whatsoever. I think it’s wonderful. Not sure where the misunderstanding came from…

  • Everyone who knew Bob would be back please raise your hands.

  • Comparing gas prices around the globe . . . may I chime in from Stuttgart, Germany:
    Super 1 liter €1.60 – doing the US $ / Euro and liter/gal conversion the gallon is roughly
    9.10 in US $ still it doesn’t stop anybody from driving.-

    After this off-topic theme on burn, hopefully not a faux pas – plugging photography from my archive:



  • Seeing the sublime, or whatever that indefinable quality is, in others work is a personal evolution just as finding that quality in your own personal vision is a journey. I honestly have never, and still do not, feel qualified to critique someone else’s vision but rather to work to appreciate it and in the process to better define and grow my own. That work which challenges me the most often also expands my ability to see, truly see, the world through the lens of my own personal reality. And it is this evolution, through exploration of other’s vision and through often painfully hard work and critique of my own work, that has led me to see the world quite a bit differently than I did just a few years ago. I can more quickly step back from the learned to see the wonder, or the ridiculous, around me all the time such that my own perceptions seem increasingly surreal. Perhaps this does not make sense to you but it is this evolution, which is about so much more than just photography, for which I will always be grateful to Road Trips, and Burn, and Mr. Harvey, and this evolving community in general.

    This is something great, so I would simply ask that you treat it and everyone involved with some respect and in the process, yourself, for what you write today, you may well cringe at tomorrow. Or, to be more blunt, grow the fuck up already.

  • Sorry David, I really should just stay silent.

  • MW…

    me neither..not even sure there is any misunderstanding as far as i know…i was just writing on your comment that the “EPF finalists did not look any different than any other day on Burn”…you did say that..or something very close to that….so i was responding to that and that alone…oh you also said something about “joining the choir”…so you did say those two things Michael…little digs…fine..but they will elicit a response my friend…this is a pattern…passive/aggressive pattern…you say something and then act as if you said nothing..this is often the beef people have with you here..flip flop…say what you mean, and mean what you say..if you type it in , you have said it..stick by it if you believe it..i respect a solid stance….

    on a very positive note about actual photography and not prose….your work has grown by leaps and bounds this year at a very high rate..in high school parlance, you get “most improved” …i have watched you go from fairly simple street work to a more complex and intellectual vision…i look forward to seeing where you go next..keep this going and i do not care what you say!! this does not however ameliorate what i said above…it is just another truth imo…

    i do always look forward to your comments…you are here and you are thinking..

  • iPad question: someone can confirm that if I shoot RAW & JPG and transfer files onto the iPad, that also the RAW files get saved? Or do I loose them? Sorry for dumb question, have to empty a full card which I need tomorrow and the only support available is an iPad.. thanks for any help.. am in digi hell and want OUT!!! ;)


    your voice is always welcomed…and you would have a way of telling me my shirt was on inside out without making me feel like a total idiot…smiling…

    hey any chance you heading back east for Look3?..would love to see you….

  • And not sure what I would be especially disappointed about. I would never expect to be super enthused about any 10 essays, especially having some feel for your proclivities and mine, so am not disappointed if I don’t think every one is the greatest. But in both years I’ve been super enthused about a few. This year so far we’ve only seen three and the most recent one is perhaps my favorite so far, not this year, but of all I’ve seen on burn, period. So in that respect, I am the far opposite of disappointed. I’m downright fucking thrilled… That’s the kind of thing to which I aspire.

  • Ha comments coming fast and furious. Can’t say I buy that flip flop label. Sometimes, usually actually, I change my opinion based on intelligent counter argument, but what’s wrong with that? Didn’t mean any dig about the EPF vs. normal thing. That says more to the consistent high quality. Just seems critical comments are less well received on the EPF entries. I tried to not make any this year, but failed miserably. The choir thing, yea, there is a choir. But I don’t see how that reference is passive-aggressive. Seems outright aggressive to me. You probably wouldn’t be surprised at how many times I was kicked out of church as a kid. Then I’d circle back into the rectory and steal the wine…

  • PAUL – thanks.

    CHARLES – yup, agreed. I wasn’t clear though – my relief re my upcoming project is merely that it will require travelling, so I’m pleased to know I’ve got a backup camera should my trusty Nikon fail randomly. My earlier comments re too much gear were a bit in jest and based on my music background – I know only too well how little gear is needed to perfect technique and how little gear is needed if you have that technique. Yet, having a backup in a situation where you’ve stumped up cash to relocate briefly to go shoot (I’m in London 1 week per month for this) knowing you can’t go out and buy a new camera, then having a spare is very comforting. Minimizes any worries so I can just get on and push myself and my camera to the limits, no concerns about “what if doing this breaks my camera?!?” or anything like that. You dig? But thanks for the comments anyway, I’m in total agreement.

    DAH – totally!! My skype is my full name, no apostrophe. I’m guessing I’m easier to find on there than you are, weird name and all. Will drop you a mail in a sec to sort it. Just got in, require music and a snack. Back soon. Also re Roller Derby – thanks for the brute comment, that’s exactly the kind of thing I want to hear! The Roller Derby is up because I like the first image in that series, the girl sitting down and mimicking the pout of the ‘poster’ on the floor. But the light in that place totally sucks and I don’t know how to get around that. Can’t use flash in that venue. And the other images being up there are really an excuse to include the one that I do like. Fair criticism.

    PAUL – re your 2nd post, as re Charles, I agree completely. Consider all comments both duly noted and acted/acting upon. I have two zooms – both the kit lenses included on the two cameras that I have. I’m not keen on them. The new Oly is incomplete without a prime, the Nikon has had a 35mm (50mm focal length) prime living on it since I got one. If I go back to the zoom, I keep it at 28mm always. Partner – uh, he’s a maybe. But he’s also great, and yes he understands this fully. He’s wonderful, we’re just doing our thing with some complications. But the trust, that essential, is there completely. Was actually chatting with him the other day and saying how I just wanted to put my head down and work through as much as I could, get as solid as possible, and he agreed on it. He gets this for various reasons and, more importantly, he really gets me.

    Re the Oyl EP2 or whatever it’s called….
    I am truly crap at the whole “gearhead” thing. No joke.

    It seems very good. Screen sucks in bright light, viewfinder is needed. Shutter response seems swift, though there’s a bad delay in being able to make another frame straight after. Low light = sucky. ISO 400/800 or less it seems (just going from back of screen here, no processing RAW files nor even checking on a computer). The rest – seems intuitive to use and yeah, a good backup I could easily get used to if needed. Digging that.

    I just wish I could figure out how to turn the silly noises off. Since when did cameras start getting spawned from one night stands between alarm clocks and microwaves?!? I’m gonna try putting a Durex on this thing. If not that, then maybe a Magnum…

    Today – pictures were mostly camera testing. Was at various Look11 photo exhibs, and had very fruitful chats re some work. All good, but not enough picture making. Meh. *note to self – clear desk of work tonight, thus enabling full day of picture making tomorrow* *2nd note to self – this includes booking train tickets*

  • Oh, and thanks for the kind words. Want to acknowledge that cause I often don’t take compliments well. There’s just so much farther to go. Not really feeling good about where I’m at. Right path, sure, but very steep and you get to the top of one hill and there’s another one staring you in the face. Have to take joy in the climbing… can’t pause to long to enjoy the plateaus.

  • David, wish, wish I could be at LOOK, especially since I’ve never been, but I’m moving my Mom from Lexington to the left coast the week before. Such a near miss in time and space. Family first :))

  • TOM,


    How are things south? Due for a visit to the big city anytime soon? Look me up!

    …alas I won’t be making it to the LOOK3 lovefest though I ache to. Just spent a week in NYC making some bucks and visiting some old and new friends and used up my Felix away time for the time being and LOOK is just too close and yet too far…


  • Charles, u can always change yo mind;)

  • 2011 Global Peace Index Result (10 most PEACEFUL & 10 MORE VIOLENT COUNTRIES AS OF TODAY)


  • Charles, a bit wet … but sunlight sliding under dark clouds too :)) I think we get about three times the rain you do. Trying to get up the mountain to an active logging site with the 4×5, so much harder to get access these days, bonding, lawyers, corporate hoops, etc. Cross a closed area/active logging area sign without permission and you are banned for life, literally, and prosecuted to fullest extent. Hmmm, TMI?

    I will definately look you up. My wife is on an NGO board in Seattle so I make it to the big city once a month or so. Maybe you can pick out a photo book from your collection to show me.

  • ANTON,
    thank u
    (Herve also thank u)

  • Eva, Go buy some more cards, way cheaper than film and safer than trusting your files to a portable device . Don’t format or erase a card until it is downloaded into a computer and backed up.

  • http://www.visionofhumanity.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/2011-GPI-Results-Report-Final.pdf

    see the most violent countries here…greece is stilll wayyyyyyyyy behind the US btw:)

  • Michelle – Jim Powers has been at odds with people here for a long time – he’s a long time photo journalist and editor. He has his opinions and these may in fact be the windows to his soul. You can definitely see his personality and character through his words… Jim can be a good guy, but like the guy I call dad, He’s got his ways and they’re not always well thought about.

  • Jason u couldnt (once again) said it more eloquently…
    i know where Michelle is coming from… but i also know where Jim P. is coming from..
    and i totally respect both…if u know what i mean…and i know u know exactly what i mean!!!!!!
    and thank u for dat!

  • Thank you Panos. I respect nearly everything that’s said here.
    And as David was saying earlier “if and when anyone here goes completely off the rails of decorum, then it seems pretty obvious to one and all and that person then seems to be standing naked in front of all…”

  • ELECTRONIC MUSIC LOVERS (David Bowen, are you listening???)

    This Memorial Day weekend — Saturday, Sunday and Monday from noon to midnight EDT — Detroit’s 12th annual Electronic Music Festival (now called Movement) will come to Hart Plaza, an urban park on the shores of the Detroit River downtown. Audio from the entire festival — every performance on all five stages — will be streamed live on http://www.residentadvisor.net/

    I will be there every minute of every day. Come join me in The Big D!!!

    Grandma Techno

  • JASON..

    for sure Jim is a good guy…i have never met him in person, but have skype video chatted with him and concluded good guy…at least in the sense he is not going to rob a bank..but sometimes, as Michelle pointed out , he is just flat out unaware of the feelings of others to an extreme degree…it is a bit odd, because he does not even try to get published here, so no sour grapes…at least not directly…i do not know what dreams Jim may have had as a young man….now, he knows where his own pictures stand..so he either really really hates almost every attempt at photography beyond a,b,c, d photo j or the whole move forward is just too painful for him…i can empathize with that…so can anyone..i just wish he had the same empathy back ….

  • JASON..

    for sure Jim is a good guy…i have never met him in person, but have skype video chatted with him and concluded good guy…at least in the sense he is not going to rob a bank..but sometimes, as Michelle pointed out , he is just flat out unaware of the feelings of others to an extreme degree…it is a bit odd, because he does not even try to get published here, so no sour grapes…at least not directly…i do not know what dreams Jim may have had as a young man….now, he knows where his own pictures stand..so he either really really hates almost every attempt at photography beyond a,b,c, d photo j or the whole move forward is just too painful for him…i can empathize with that…so can anyone..i just wish he had the same empathy back ….


    i have always respected Jim…but seriously how can you respect this line to a young woman “the psychotic photographing the psychotic”…i meqn , that is a bit over the top…he could have used some modicum of decency and made his point totally and without compromise…

    let’s just say Jim’s style gets in the way of his message..fair enough?

  • Yes, David.. Fair enough!
    Very very fair enough:(

  • a civilian-mass audience

    JIM has not accepted the key of his greek home…maybe he knew that greece will be going down…
    hiii…conspiracy theory?:))) …and he broke my civilian heart…
    BUT ,BUT
    i believe in JIM and I believe in his golden heart…he just need to polish it…
    we all need to polish or to tune up…

    WE all need to work on our EMOTIONAL INTELLGENCE…we can do it!!!

    FRAMERS,you are a tough cookie…like all my BURNIAN LADIES…
    and cookies are going well with ouzo!

    PANOS…we got it all wrong…we wish for peace…bullshit…

    WE HAVE TO MAKE PEACE,everyday and everywhere…got to work inside ,outside to earn…PEACE !!!

    Love,Peace,and Photography…I am running,like BOBBY… working for peace

  • Gordon.. thanks for your answer, which doesn’t help me though.. odd, would have thought somebody would know.. oh well, off shooting.. nice day all..

  • Eva…
    I’ve never used an iPad to transfer files but i know on every computer i’ve ever used any kind of file i’ve ever transfered by usb even if it didn’t recognise the file was saved on the hard disk. Another thing is opening a file your system does not support.

  • burning*michelle


    as civi knows, my JOB is peace, love, soul :) – so i apologize for adding any bit of negativity to this space. but i also think you have all become a bit numb to his commentary as i was quite honestly shocked that no one called him out on that remark. respectfully – it’s not just about someone’s feelings – this is about character, basic human decency and respect, and what we burnians as a society (renegade as it is) allow from each other… what our rules of the game are…our code. *m

  • Michelle …
    Fair enough..maybe numbness, a little bit of apathy true..not cool.. But as ( only talking about myself ) a Burn veteran ( happy memorial day btw ) I realized that if/when I “call someone out”, or used to, I would usually make things “worst”.. I used to attract more attention to someone’s negativity and create a mudslide.. I learned how to bite my tongue and “shut up”.. (it’s just a fever-it’ll go away kind of thing), and that’s wrong/numbness/apathy..
    I apologize for “sleeping at work” this time… Although Jim helped me last year in Greece(press pass etc), and I’m grateful for that, still I had no excuse for “sleeping at work”…
    I’m sure that will be one of the “topics” up in Look3..
    The “not sleeping at work” idea I mean..
    Peace and hugs again..
    Good morning All (gnight Europe):))))

  • Paul.. me either (used the pad), so now I wonder how I’ll get off the RAW files.. hope they’re attached to the JPGs.. anyway, the two or three pics that really matter are on film :)

    Michelle.. sometimes somebody standing naked in front of others deserves sympathy.. and sometimes not.. just my opinion..

  • Gil Scott-Heron, RIP…

  • patricia.. ahh would love to..

    funny you mention – my in-head calendar has been ticking LOUD of late.. season has started .. fires lit..

    unfortunately, i have plans.. unable to leave norwayland until i have fulfilled them :o)

    hope you have a blast.

  • “the psychotic photographing the psychotic”………..if anything a person with that nature would probably produce great stuff or alternatively not participating at all.


    “David, wish, wish I could be at LOOK, especially since I’ve never been, but I’m moving my Mom from Lexington to the left coast the week before. Such a near miss in time and space. Family first :))”

    Lexington which state??? If KY you hopefully will give me a call, glad to assist if possible….

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